All charm is lost...

Here's my two cents on the matter. I would rather have the most comfortable shoe possible if I'm paying that much money for a pair of bespoke shoes. So if I lose a bit of the hand making and the charm to get the absolute perfect fit then so be it. I've had shoe makers mess up the last before when I was getting a pair of a Austrian shoes made for me and the fit was terrible and killed my feet with terrible pain worse than buying a cheap made to order shoe. I have very wide feet with a super high arch but the rest of my foot is very skinny height wise. So the ability to scan your foot and have the last perfectly made to your foot is worth the loss of the hand made last charm. So to me the charm of all the custom measurements being taken by hand and stuff is not worth it to me for that comfort. The shoes themselves are still made by a craftsman and that's the best part of the getting a shoe made by a bespoke shoe and yes the artist element of the shoe does make it important with the shape of the last but the fact is the more accurate the measurement are the better the fit and comfort. So overall I think the scans aren't a bad thing and think of it like this some shoe makers make a last and do test fit with shoes with the proper shape but with sub par scrap materials as a test fit shoe they cut apart and they have to adjust the last and stuff. Overall less time from measurement to shoe with fewer steps and less visits is for sure worth it to me. But it is something to think about. Overall the bespoke shoe industry is changing for sure with technology and it's going to be interesting to see how the way they are made and stuff changes in the near future.

@jeffTheG44 That's what test fittings are for. You could still end up with an uncomfortable shoe even with scans.

​@@billyjackson5664well I talked about it in my comment and most test fit shoes are made from subpar materials and end up being cut apart and then just thrown out after. Also for me it's a large commitment of time to go to most bespoke shoe fitters and ends up at least for me being a most of the day adventure with travel time if not longer depending on how you have to get there and the distance. I mean for me I love a good solid english oxford and a trip to London from here is a minimum 3 day thing. So like I said the less trips you can make from measurement to finished comfortable shoe the better for me. Now that's my opinion and some people like it and find it nice and part of the art process. even if it means a less artisanal approach to it to me shoes are tools not show peieces and I think buying shoes for art is a dumb waste of money cause I just have dumb stupid shaped feet and normal made to order shoes dont fit and hurt my feet. So for me the extra time wasted on fittings with sub par materials that may or may not actually be as comfortable as the actual shoe and you may need multiple fitting days apart to get a propper comfortable shoe. So to have to spend up to several days flying to a different country multiple times for it to me as a man just looking for comfortable shoes not art seems like a waste. and I can tell you with the scanned shoes I've had a pair and they 3D printed a softer shoe that you could try on with a leather like material that felt and acted like leather and it honestly ended up being just as comfortable pretty much as the finished leather shoe and it was made the same afternoon as the scans. So like I said to me it comes down to time and the amount of travel. Like I said if you want an artisanal shoe for more art than thing you'll walk around for 12 hours a day like I do then hey man go for it. Just from my perspective as a dude who just wanted comfortable shoes not art I looked at my options and stuff and I was willing to pay a lot of money for the shoes and I was thinking 10k for it since I watched several videos and talked to several people and it was one of the english shoe makes who actually told me about the company I went with. They said you dont sound like our type of customer we service people who are looking for life long art not a tool and they said they would take me as a client and do it but the process would be a lot different just to make a comfortable shoe like I wanted. So I got the phone number for this company and it was great. They understood what I was looking for and they did it and did it well.

So did I! That was kinda funny.

How is it utilized for running shoes?

On what? 👀

on what??

on what??

On what??

Carminas after care service isn’t great

The process of crafting the last and adjusting a pattern will inevitably involve considerable amount of work by humans. It's not going to be cheap. You'd have to pretty much fully automate that process and nobody has managed that, yet. And in places like Italy, you can get bespoke shoes in this price range from small shops. It's not like you couldn't participate if you can afford to pay €1500+. Personally, I don't consider it a good value. Because, at the end of the day, the manufacturing, the construction, materials, everything is the same. It might be a good offer if you really struggle and can't find shoes that fit well. You have a significant asymmetry. Or if you want to do something different (it appears that is a possibility). I do envy the lasted shoe trees. I would love it if those were an option for MTO shoes.

Well said! I would imagine traditional bespoke shoemaking would not really be affected by this. The traditional bespoke client probably won't go from "true" bespoke to this, but it will definitely pull up a new client base for those that want the best fit possible without the several thousands of dollars required by traditional bespoke.

I don't think we can call this bespoke honestly, that is just false advertisement in my book like many companies call their MtM operation bespoke tailoring. Compared to the kind of G&G of course these prices seem good but compare it to e.g. Vass handwelted with adjusted lasts, Saint Crispin's with bespoke lasts, shoemakers in Italy... it seems rather bad value for a factory shoe. The upcharge for the last making is around 1000$. (At least.) Maftei for example produces handwelted bespoke shoes (including the last) from 1000€. If we are talking about value the Carmina offer is not that good. But design wise if you love Carmina then this is a very special way to get shoes from them with your own personal fit. And in the end only you can say if this is something you wish to spend your money on. I think they are trialing this process for now but what would be really good value, and I guess they will probably do this at some point, is if you only paid for the last once and then you could use it for multiple pairs of shoes for a small upcharge after that. But I don't see any mention of that on their website.

Not in my experience

Ken try not to simp.

@@Mankster23😂😂😂 let him love bro

They looking so good in this video!

They are from Spain

If information isn’t forthcoming here, ask a/your tailor. A lot will depend on your lifestyle. Do you need a city suit for work or do you just like a suit when you go out for dinner. How formal is the dinner, lounge suit or full dinner (then black tie white). What climate do you live in. Are you likely to be out hunting. A morning suit for a formal wedding. Country tweeds. Non matching trousers and jacket. Are you a safe grey or bright check sort of person. Do you want a single or double breasted jacket. Wool, cotton, moleskin, corduroy, wool mix. 2 or 3 piece. That’s why you know more about what you need than someone else!

You need to listen to SartorialTalks on here. He's great. Personally, I think that you can go far with buying used suits on Ebay, being serious about your body shape and spending EXTRA but not lots on shoes. Lots of people notice good shoes, women especially. Can't go wrong with Oxfords in black or a rich dark brown etc. Wear them in and polish the hell out of them.

$1600.00 starting in new york city location. I saw it on carmina website

Damn she said a standard scan and shoe is $1800 that’s crazy my dude

you lost me at Bostonian. I view that as a Macy's brand. Not good

@mtbokor1969 I don't know about Macy's, it was 2001 and they came from Men's Wearhouse (not much better, for certain, but it was my 1st year of Law School, so I couldn't afford much and $500 was my limit) but they were good for off the shelf. They were repairable and made well.

It makes sense. 20 years ago there was no internet to buy shoes from. Mens Warehouse was and still is a great place to shop. Allen Edmonds is not the same brand it was 20 years ago. Things change. @@johncashwell1024

We'll see if it actually is good. Bespoke shoes are also very good because they are handwelted. Carmina's are not, as they explicitly stated here. You'd have to be a huge Carmina fan to prefer this over other bespoke manufacturers.

It all depends on the program that creates the last. Last making is not only about taking measurements, a good bespoke shoemaker will also note gaze and problematic areas. Shoe fit is also incredibly individual which is why a one fits all program will not work in the same way.

@@teekue what youre talking about is fine tuning a last. Im saying that the initial last which takes a 3D scan of your foot will 100 times out of 100 be a more accurate representation of the foot than a manual crafted one ever will. Its just a fact. Creating a 3D imaged last first then fine tuning it manually will be the future, except for the elitist that want to keep an outdated old tradition going

@@Masson1903 maybe it will be, but don't forget that these things cost a lot of money. Small operations will not be able to afford this, so they will stick to handwork. Scalability is key here. I have read discussions on this topic from lastmakers who said that their own measurements when compared to the 3d scans were as accurate as the scan. Don't forget that people have been saying for years that machines will take over in high end tailoring/shoemaking. And who is still on top? The ones with the most amount of handwork and experience possible.

Anywhere from 400 to 1200 depending on the materials selected, I got my bespoke ones for 500.

You got made to order for 500, not bespoke.@@saparicio89

⁠​⁠@@saparicio89you got custom shoes on their standard last for 500$. Those aren’t bespoke. Their bespoke program starts at 1800

I believe Carmina said that the 3D Bespoke price started at $1800 depending on the material chosen.

Right, but Kirby said $5000 is what it normally costs to get this sort of thing. Maftei is under $1500 and Materna is under $2000 for handsewn bespoke shoes.@@arthurcatalanotto1151

All three make quality shoes. Affordable? Depneds on your definition. Camina has raised prices and a RTW shoe starts between $500- $700. There are some internet only brands doing hand lasted shoes for that price.

@@mtbokor1969 also Alden and affordable? 😂

Last 2 women on earth?😂

@@k13m13No, 2 last women on earth. Shoe last.😂😂😂

You didnt watch the video as they talk about cost of the bespoke shoes

@@mtbokor1969 I did watch the entire video but must have missed that information.

$1800 as a starting point

@@monochromebluess Thanks for your helpful answer! Watched the video again and found that I missed it.

Carmina makes awesoome goodyear welted shoes. It is a personal taste issue in terms of whose design/last fits you best. I personally do not like any of the UK based manufactures designs. I lean towards spanish makers like TLB and Carmina and some from China and Japan like Oct 10, Yearn and Ichigo Ichie.

@@mtbokor1969 you do get more bang for your buck from the Spanish makers. But some designs are timeless from the isles. If it is worth the upcharge... Not for me personally but for some it is.

Quality, craftsmanship, and the latest in machine learning technology.

Using technology doesn’t change the craftsmanship. The needle, the thread, each part incorporates new technologies. So a more precise measurement is just another step forward.

@@Howard_Roark craftsmanship of last making will be lost this way, don't you agree? I am sceptical if this is as good as they say.

Watch the video to find out the price

The problem with bespoke lasts is that everyone likes their shoe fits differently. Justin Fitzpatrick talked about it in one of his videos. Americans like very spacious shoes, Europeans like a more snug fit etc

Are you serious? Did you see him struggle with opening the front door to the Carmina store? Seriously!

I don't think so. If I am going to pay $2k plus for bespoke, i want the artisan interaction. I recently had a made to measure suit done for $800. Measured in the US, made in China and then final fitting back in US. I can't buy an off the rack suit for $800.

😂😂😂