Optimum is a reviewer , Linus is a glorified qvc salesman

@@willrussI agree with you and would argue that applies to 90% of techtubers. Paul’s Hardware, Bitwit, Jayztwocents,MKBHD-all marketing

exactly@@willruss

Man if I own a multi-trillion dollars company I would want Ali to unbox my products

Pretty sure Optimum purchases everything himself.

That's a genuinely great anecdote, but in this case I think the critique is that the Mac is capable of more but was handicapped for audio aesthetics. A great metaphor for the difference between Macs and PCs tbh.

I get that, but you probably can wash dishes very efficiently and silently, whereas when it comes to chips, you just know you could be getting better performance for some more noise, because that cooling directly translates to some more speed headroom. At least it would be cool to have the option to tune that a bit higher if that is what you'd like

I totally agree! As an acoustical engineer myself, I just thought it was interesting.

It somewhat again boiles down to the Apple "Philisophy" - let Cupertino take the decision for you - we know best, what you want... Vs. on PC you are in control - when you are willing to invest some time to learn so you know, what you are doing. My PC is tweaked to be absolutely silent during office-workload - I have to look at the light to see if it's on. But I allow it to ramp up cooling and sound to an definately hearable level, when I need full power to get the job done faster. Could also tweak it to remain more silent by sacrificing maybe 10-20% performance under load - or get 10% more when I would accept higher noise...

@@robocobrabot So i know folks who have worked on that platform. Basically its not capped thermally in any sense, except the form factor itself which has space limitations. The bearings in the fan that are essentially very high quality and ensure no noise even when fans spin at higher RPM. you dont get that in the PC world.

It also shows that 5500 and 7000 doller have the same audio processing as a 600 doller pc. Must be stupid to spend that much and not have a premium sound card. Sound is better of an upgrade then video quality. And it's much cheaper.

@@yugecrazystickthe only difference with the Mac Pro is the customizable PCI slots

@@yugecrazystickwhat M2 extreme?

Yep, interesting. Curious to see how much better the M3 Ultra will fare. But when that comes out we might have 8700X3D and 5090 to compare witth on the PC/Windows side. :)

@@metabang03 Uhhhh, what? What does sound have to do with it. Get a good audio interface and you're done.

I don’t know why people hate on Apple like they make genuinely good products

@@henryhallam5270 Apple can make a good product and still deserve hate, and if you don't know what the common bones to pick are with Apple then you're in a bubble.

@@henryhallam5270 It's just good ole Apple, creates a problem then sells the solution on a really greedy way, they're kinda like the Ferrari of the tech world

@@henryhallam5270 purposefully making their product a bit bad so people would upgrade to the next gen? try updating your ios/ipados before new product launch and watch it suffer. iphone 15 and 15 pro have usb-c but only the pro have usb 3.0, no fast charging. because the next iphone 16 pro will have fast charging instead, and the 16 will have usb 3.0, but not fast charging, lol. imagine recording pro res raw just to copy the files the same speed as the lightning cable. "the iphone gates" And the usb 3.0 is sold separately. Noice ;)

@@prntm926 bussiness is bussiness, nobody forces you to buy these phones. I'd prefer slow steady biz oriented improvements over fast released, grounbreaking half broken products like for example first gen foldables. Im still using my iphone 13pro, while there arent many if any first gen samsung foldable users without broken screen out there.

facts

Gamer Boi's gonna game 😂

This.

same thing with only have 32gb of ram, it would probably only be like a couple hundred more dollars to upgrade to a full 64gb

@@pjay459850 bucks more at the moment lol

🤓🤓

🤓🤓

Pricing wise, it's more realistic to compare it with a HEDT part like the 32-core 7990x. A 7950x + mid tier gpu + ram could be had for just $2000, that's barely a fair comparison to a $7000 mac. Honestly, at $9000 you could already get a 96 core Threadripper Pro in. That would amount to roughly 6x performance at the same price for the type of work the mac is designed for.

I was thinking the same thing. Apple people always shade it. I could build a PC to smash that for $5k

Yeah that's literally what he said in the video at 4:40...

True and for those of us who know the producs well it's pretty obvious. But for people who don't, it's worth emphasising that the 7800x3D is a very efficient beast for gaming, but if your focus is video editing, both AMD and Intel offer products much better suited to that task. An Intel 14700k for example, at £420, would be a far better choice - the 14900k or Ryzen 7950x better still. You would also have a far better PC if you compromised on the form factor, didn't mind some noise and were tolerant of a high electricity bill. I can see why people might choose either the Studio or get a good builder to spec a workstation PC. My preference would be the latter, but if I used the rest of the Apple eco-system (and especially if I was used to FInal Cut Pro) I might go with Apple.

yep really useless to compare a gaming pc to a mac studio with productivity tasks. Get a better cpu then compare, the 5 k build is already like 2k wasted anyways.

I'm a fan of the channel, but lots of bias and misinformation in this video though :(. But maybe he truly believes he is being honest.

@@DeltaNovum As someone with both PC’s and Mac’s in my household, can you please elaborate on the perceived bias?

Nobody's stopping you from paying the Apple tax.

His channel is definitely quality over quantity. He was also way ahead of the curve on his small form factor PC case compared to Gamers Nexus. GN initially claimed the case limited the ability to have a 4090

@@DeltaNovumI mean you can’t say all that and not show any proof. You obviously are just a troll with no good input

it renders almost seemless with rtx.

Nice info

Also he used a tiled rendering on the gpu, which is slower on a modern GPU

I imagine that's already on if the card is already 25x faster.

@@utubekullanicisi you have no clue of how high 40 series can soar in blender

He has a 3 part build series on it

"A dedicated competetive GPU would be the next step for Apple" - Intel are struggling with GPU's, so Apple has zero chance. they need to use amd/nvidia gpu's but they're too proud and their users tend to have more money than sense, which means Apple doesn't get punished for poor performance choices

I agree that Intel is struggeling, but wouldnt you say it's good that we have more companies entering the GPU market? Sounds like you'd rather have two companies run the monopoly on all GPU's. The more the better! @@BOZ_11

@@BOZ_11 If Apple did this it will of course not be comparable to what Intel is doing, it will be something you can only get in the workstation solutions like Mac Pro

@@marcusellby whatever they do it'll be lacking in performance compared with the pc space. That's always been true, it's true today, and maybe forever, since intel, AMD, Nvidia push each other in a race that apple doesn't really partake in

I mean, integrated GPUs have a significant advantage in many areas. They share unified memory, can have higher bandwidth if the memory is collocated on the silicon. Dedicated GPUs only have the advantage of being able to be mixed & matched with the CPU for the work loaded needed and to be swapped in case of failure or upgrade needs, plus the ability for specialised cooling. Plus the ability to be MORE silicon than a single design - although chiplets can mitigate this. These dedicated advantages are actually outweighed by the advantages for integrated. A dedicated GPU isn't the way to catch up.

denoising is the biggest loss and dent on the mac ever, pc shines with denoising and 3d work

Dude is the complete package. Passionate about hardware, but actually depends on fast compute for his day job so he can “talk shop” for actual potential users of these products. Also he’s actually quite good at gaming, which is the other audience.

He only shows real world scenarios for a content creator.

It's a good comparison. 9:57 a 8k Mac has input lag for CS go, lol. This mean the Mac commercial was a lie. They should change it to "Mac, a machine that cost you an arm and a leg for web browsing" You might wanna sell your 5k desktop and get a laptop instead if you h8 updating the softwares. My $200 laptop can play Starfield on ultra settings at 1080p with a few tweaks. My video is up.

​@sethglazier2877 a well-rounded content creator with appeal to differing audiences is someone that deserves more attention

Isn't that the purpose and the title of this video? So you want to test mac with windows?

@@sssss4644 Mmmm, you missed the part where the PC costs $5496! 😁 You don't buy a gaming CPU for that price, so no it's not the point at all.

@@dtrjones yeah, I’m with mac side as I also used it for work / productivity and windows for gaming

​@@sssss4644my amd threadripper with 4080 will crush that mac in both gaming and productivity im a graphic designer and a video editor my self

​@@sssss4644And it cost 9 k

pre-built brother

The 3D rendering and gaming performance on Macs is going to get a huge over haul with the new 3 nm silicon. So it'll be interesting to compare things once the M3 line come out. I'm particularly interested to see what the AMD response will be, and if they'll fire back with some monster APU's in 2025

You can buy a fully-kitted out pre-built for probably half the price of the Mac.

@@Linux_Fan_Boi_76 intel/amd/nvidia have always been faster than apple. tomorrow won't be any different

@@BOZ_11 Good luck finding a pre-built T1 with a 4090 lmao

or an i9 13900k

For 5.500$ there needs to be a 7950X3D with minimum of 64GB RAM and Look than, specially if you use Linux instad of Windows.

Or a xeon/threadripper

Agreed, this is not really an apples to apples comparison when using a PC chip specifically designed for 3d gaming vs one designed for exactly the tests he is performing.

@@Robert-jl6mhThat’s what I built a few months ago… 7950x3D… 64GB 6000mhz CL30 with a 4090… and 32TB (yes 32) SSD space. A dream machine. 👍

Heat, a lot of heat. I personally got 13700k but cooling was kinda pain in the ass. I went from mini to full tower cos of that. If custom loop is out of budget and/or size/silence is in priority 7800x3d makes more sense in a gaming/working mini pc.

@@VargpinM Well, get 7950x. It consumes 120W max undervolted and will crush this apple crap. I have it, I know. It scores 2200 on cinebench r24.

My i7 13700KF, with 5,5 GHz p cores and 4,4 GHz e cores scored 1797 in Cinebench 2024 while drawing 230W on average. This apple CPU is a work of art considering performance/power consumption and heat production

@@uuuaaa96Well yeah, compared to Intel, what are they on now, 10nm +++++?

@@uuuaaa96 In that case AMD's CPUs are work of art too. Well, they are :)

I mean ITX parts are expensive. Everything was custom built, I think some parts were even 3D printed. But I think the main reason was to give the Mac Studio a chance. The Studio has no way of beating any good Mini ITX PC

@@RobloxianX I don't think it should be a handicapped build just to give a the studio a chance to compete.

I mean to be fair it is the fastest and most efficient gaming cpu in the world

​@@SuuperwuuperGaming focused CPU not for productivity.

from where did you get that info lmao?? yk that a rtx 4090 pulls almost 1000 watts and m2 ultra 35 right? literally makes no sense even if you d underclock the rtx 4090 to a max of 500 watts

@@doomfistXD from the video lmfao roflcopter lololol111!!! yk that at 13:15 he shows the performance per watt of Optimums 4090, which is underclocked, vs the M2, which is hitting 110 watts... So your entire comment is drivel.

@@peterdolkens669 its still isnt 3x the performance

108 Vs 337 for cinebench GPU test. Sorry about your maths test bro 😔

@@peter.dolkens with 3x+ the power usage from the rtx 4090...

But, is the new cinebench GPU benchmark 100% optmized for Apple Silicon, Metal 3, and with Native ARM support. Cause I know the Mac Studio’s GPU is not 4 times slower than the RTX 4090, at least not in the Geekbench GPU test. And multiple games have had issues detecting the ultra fusion connector that combines the 2 Max chips that make up the Ultra chip, and I’m sure that making an M3 Extreme chip, fusing 2 ultra chips, would best the 4090, and maybe even the upcoming 5090… And, Blender doesn’t have full Mac support yet, why the results were so bad. Please for the future read up on this stuff, to make it a fair comparison. And lastly, I don’t care if the fastest PC is faster, cause the Mac is so much more efficient, with performance per watt being unmatched, and that’s what it takes to save our planet, replacing all x86 chips with passively cooled ARM chips. And you can just download a 3rd party tool to max out the fans for additional performance, even though the Mac Studio M2 Ultra doesn’t throttle, at all.

@@ncard00Dawg he said that it'd be less confusing to have a "lower/higher is better" text, nothing more 💀

@@ncard00 you're delusional if you think that using more efficient CPUs on desktops will "save the planet". Especially with renewable energy becoming more prevalent. You certainly have bought into Apple's "green" marketing on that one.

The powerdraw would be worse though, as the X3Ds are limited to around 105w, where as the others go to 170w. Performance pr watt is higher though, and he COULD get a 7950X3D which is 120w.

The price of a productivity CPU and loadout would also put the PC in a similar price range. For example, that Mac had 192GB of ram. And it's not normal memory. The M2 memory runs at 400GB/s. The only place you'll see that bandwidth for a PC is on L3 cache.

My 7700x did 120 single core 1143 all core. PPT maxed out at 85 Watt. Good enough. I love Macs but I have a bunch of other expenses.

it certainly is a CPU mismatch in terms of product category, but not necessarily in terms of footprint - which i think was the point of the video - workstation class X86-64 CPUs would (i think) require more cooling than that packaging can provide, and even with the smaller CPU it needs liquid to cool

It's mostly about matching with form factor and how close you can get a PC that is the size and power of the Studio me thinks.

No matter how many optimizations are done on any MAC, it'll never come close to touching that 4090GPU at all. Remember, a dedicated GPU is hard to beat.

@@williamcopeland2617 I agree with you. As I said in my original comment “not saying the mac would have come anywhere near that 4090…” but optimisations do make a big difference when comparing it to itself before and after

It counts for a lot these days!

denoising is the biggest loss and dent on the mac ever, pc shines with denoising and 3d work

The title is literally clickbait lol

+250$ and we will have ryzen 7950x or 13900k Apple never chances...

@@klim6361or even a 7950X3D if you're willing to spend a little more

I mean to be fair the 4TB Storage in the Mac Studio is super expensive but doesn't play a huge role in performance so.. you can cut 2 grand here

not really because you’re also buying that small form factor which is obviously not easy to engineer which stays cool and absolutely silent all the time. It’s almost always not ideal to only take into consideration price and performance

Apple you are paying for branding and limited product usage

That’s because they rarely break

@@datasleek7950 lmao sure buddy

​@@datasleek7950lmao everything will break in due time. But apple products break faster than most.

@@carontorliak2760 And you say this based on what? I work for Hulu. 75% of the Developer use Mac. The support team is just 10 people for 100s of employees. They spend more time fixing Windows than Mac. I'm sorry but you are wrong.

@@datasleek7950 by break i don't mean literally stop working at all (though I wouldn't be surpised if that was also true), I mean you can't use a 10 year old apple pc the same way you can use a 10 year old windows pc of same similar spec/price. With a high end workstation pc you can upgrade almost endlessly whereas you can't even easily repair a mac, let alone upgrade it as the op said. That with apple's mission of planned obsolescence basically makes you get a new mac just because it doesn't work properly anymore due to outdated macOS. I am sorry but your anecdote proves nothing.

Yep. Cinebench 2024 results for my 7950x3D/4090/64GB 6000mhz CL 30 system. Single core = 117 Multi core = 2027 GPU = 34152 Virtually no difference in the single core and GPU scores when compared to the 7800x3D/4090 system in this video... but the 7800x3D is blown away in the multi core score which is exactly why I didn't buy it. Great for gamers... not so much when you want a CPU that can do both gaming and workstation tasks.

Certainly fair, but the fact they're no longer dependent on third party CPU/GPU suppliers seems to have sped up their hardware refresh cycle quite a bit.

The nice thing is they appear to now be on an annual upgrade cycle. I do think for price the Max is the sweet spot not the Ultra.

The Apple silicon macs are getting updated every 1 or 2 years

Except Apple updates the machines on a yearly basis.

The issue is that Apple has been historically hamstrung by their partners, first Motorola, then IBM, and then Intel. Intel's multiple year delays for Haswell had to be the last straw for Apple. Now that they're developing all of their hardware in house they can have a regular and predictable cadence of hardware that is specifically tailored to their needs (power efficiency, media application performance)

agreed

For a desktop computer, power usage means very little. Expandability, and a huge software base give Windows the advantage.

When apple switched there desktop cpus to the m1 they got tsmc to give them the way newer shit so there at 3nm and everyone else is at 5 ot 7nm even 10 in some cases, but, it caused all the competition to start making there own manufacturing plants.

@@justinpatty1954 The competition cannot 'make' their own manufacturing plants. Everything is made by TSMC, or Samsung, or Global. M1 and M2 are quite impressive, when you consider they are basically just fast chips that come from a *cell* *phone* . Too bad that native software, and especially games, are very very limited on Apple Silicon.

​@@DerekDavis213 You would change your mind about electricity consumption if you lived in a country like Germany. If I had both devices idling 24/7, that makes a difference of $280 per year in my electric bill.

@@DerekDavis213power usage still matters if you need vast computing power, so efficiency is still very important

I remember many Mac products used to thermal throttle for the sake of silence I guess (and form factor?).... At least they have a low power cpu's now that can run silent under full stress :)

@@akse What are you talking about? All Intel Macs I have come across are just as noisy as their PC counterparts. If by 'many Mac products' you are referring to laptops, it's normal that they throttle.

Cinebench 2024 results for my 7950x3D/4090/64GB 6000mhz CL 30 system. Single core = 117 Multi core = 2027 GPU = 34152 Virtually no difference in the single core and GPU scores when compared to the 7800x3D/4090 system in this video... but the 7800x3D is blown away in the multi core score which is exactly why I didn't buy it. Great for gamers... not so much when you want a CPU that can do both gaming and workstation tasks.

While I think he’s incorrect about his conclusion about pc hardware being slower (just his processor), you are correct, Apple’s hardware is ahead on power consumption. But that is a low priority for commercial tools.

@@thefryinallofus Fair enough. At the same time, a lot of these machines aren't necessarily meant for truly corporate/commercial use. They're still for much smaller business that do care about energy use and power consumption, I would imagine. It may not seem like much, but over time, there could be a drastic difference in energy usage and cost.

@@tylerberg8686 So to compensate GPU weakness, you buy a second overpriced device ? Not sure small companies can afford 20 k devices to save on 20-50$ energy a year.

its pretty much the only thing reviewers of apple products talk about. which is fine on a tablet or phone(even there it doesnt matter much, cause they pair it with a smaller battery). The only place i can see it matter is on their laptop, but they also pair it with a smaller battery instead of crushing the competition(the macbook air M2 battery is the same size as my android phone).

"Neither PC nor Mac should be considered the "end-all-be-all" for every application." They are tools, both with strengths and weaknesses, but as a former PC user I can tell you PC people are far less willing to try Macs than the other way around.

Exactly, you don't have to build a PC, you have the option to build it... Most people buy prebuilt systems or laptops, not all users are computer enthusiasts or tech savvy.

Not to mention that there are many third party companies, both small local shops and larger internet order companies, that will build you a custom PC for your use case and tweak the overclocking so you have all of the benefits of a custom build, but with the exact same plug and play factors. A good PC builder will even prep your windows install and install all the software you request for you.

yeah the last thing I would've expected was for them to send it to optimum even if his videos are as pristine as their brand image

High praise why? Apple says no to bigger channels that hold them accountable so what is the bar you think applies here? Cause I think it's obvious.

@@opx4real High praise in that even if you call apple out on their complete douchebaggery they will not touch 99% of youtubers with a ten foot pole due to how uninspired and lackluster their output is as tech channels. Optimum is clearly in the top 10%. And as a non apple reviewer usually there has not been much opportunity to make any sort of commentary on them in the first place.

@@ImPDK Absolutely, his channel has mostly nothing to do with apple products. His videos surpass apples presentations. They have really taken a nose dive since steve left.

Agreed good on them.

Especially with such a pricepoint to compare, he cou have used a xeon or threadripper instead...

@@erlm595 not even just a 7950x or something like this which would easily fit within that budget.

⁠@@jlee936013900k… they cost pretty much the same, around 500 dollars but the i9 is faster and has more cores.

Yup, this video is basically pointless

@@jlee9360 yeah throughout the whole video i was thinking "what a shame he didnt have a top cpu, either a 13900ks or 7950x3d, would have made this video more interesting comparing top to top, and not top to near top... but yeah, had he gone for one of those or even a workstation cpu, then the pc woul've performed even a lot better

first, why x3d, thats specifically made for gaming, plus its not even top of line lmao

I think R9 7950X3D would be a better competitor. at $5K still fits the budget

Instructions unclear: mac flew into the ceiling and crashed somewhere 20 miles away: Steve Jobs ghost haunts me telling me fans are bad

I mean his cpu is like 400usd

​@@casualmime2792 Believe it or not, this is outside of the range of most PC buyers. That's still high-end, even if it's not a flagship like the 13900K. Things like the 13900K and 7950X are halo products. I only bought mine because I want uncompromised performance.

But that pulls even more watts from that wall equaling more wasted energy…. Apple is going to dominate the market, sorry.

@@christophervanzetta bruh 7800x3d is gaming only its just not meant for single or multicore performance

@@christophervanzetta with the price difference between this M2 and an equally performing 7950 built you can pay your electricity for 3 years.

Cinebench 2024 results for my 7950x3D/4090/64GB 6000mhz CL 30 system. Single core = 117 Multi core = 2027 GPU = 34152 Virtually no difference in the single core and GPU scores when compared to the 7800x3D/4090 system in this video... but the 7800x3D is blown away in the multi core score which is exactly why I didn't buy it. Great for gamers... not so much when you want a CPU that can do both gaming and workstation tasks.

@@rishavkumar7133 Yep... just posted my 7950x3D results in my comment above this one.

And that you can maintain it - the apple brand philosophy of locking you out and " if it breaks just buy another one" has zero appeal to me

​@@jameshetherington1 Exactly why I will never buy an Apple product. The whole company makes me nauseous.

@@777trader8 constructing something out of pre-existing parts is still building regardless of complexity, whether it's Lego, a house or a computer

@@777trader8 "You didn't build anything. You simply put together products like doing a puzzle." By that logic no one builds a house either. Because they didn't mill the lumber, burn the bricks or create the design.

@@jameshetherington1 The appeal of the Apple ecosystem is that it's just take it out of the box and go, and their build quality is generally pretty incredible. For studios and offices, that's awesome because it cuts down on the time between ordering the system and getting up and running on it, and for most people it's great because they just want easy and quick access to basic functionality. As someone that also worked in one of their retail stores in college, the "if it breaks just buy another one" applies more to the people buying the products - I saw plenty of affluent folks plunk down thousands of dollars to buy a new computer/phone/iPad rather than wait a few days for their other one to be repaired! I use an M1 MBP for work, along with a personal iPad Air and a 13 pro iPhone, and I love that my apple products require very little maintenance. Everything does just work, and if I do have any issues with them, there's a store a short subway ride away that I can take it to. They also are very repairable as well, outside of the iPad, they just lock down the access to parts, which I get can be annoying. However, for casual, day to day stuff, that ease and approachability is very appealing to me. I've used Apple products since I was a kid, some of them for over 10 years, and have never had a catastrophic problem with any of them that I didn't cause by being an idiot with a coffee or glass of water. I also have a solid gaming PC that I built and that I still enjoy tinkering with as a hobby. If anything goes wrong, it's up to me to troubleshoot and repair, which is fun sometimes, and it's fine when it's not something my livelihood isn't relying on. There's also something satisfying about updating parts and keeping up with the current market, and being able to game at the upper end of performance is awesome.

lol.. you should see some of these PC's that have 10 intake fans..

Why do you buy things you don't like. Bizarre

@@marcyd700 The life of apple users. I'll say for the most part, it's a status symbol versus utility.

@@Stix_Zidinia if it has more intake fans with filter it create good positive pressure inside case and your case stay clean from dust, while you only need to clean filters sometime

@@PickAPocky He might be an Apple hater who pretends to be an Apple User. I saw that a lot.

@@RiyadhcraftWhy? Most of the tests in the video were CPU-bound.

And with porting toolkit Im acutally hopeful in 3-4 years there will be legit gaming on Mac. That's the single reason I don't switch back.

@@Adam-vx6to I can imagine that but it will only be cost effective if you already own a very fast Mac for work.

@@Dionyzos if developers actually release games natively on Mac then they should be playable on most of the entry level chips

mobile gaming lmao

@@ThunderingRoar did you see the presentation today?

for real. a lot of the graphs are misleading.

considering that it doesn't support external GPUs probably not any better.

And if Apple it did it would probably be a $3k option for base GPU given the "mark-up" on ram with Apple!@@user-mn8lz7gf6d

That will be a Dream Come True, no need for me to buy a PC and Apple, one Computer Does it all....wow! Am really fantasizing here ..lol

Will never happen

But apple isn't x86 so it eats shit in real world use (as you can see in gaming)

⁠​⁠​⁠@@FaySmashI think I’d say real world use includes productivity video editing and coding. And it doesn’t eat shit when doing them.

@@milkyy4168 yea but it can only use ARM/RISC programs, it can’t use any software built around x86, which accounts for most of the pc software in existence at the moment