Field Oriented Control of Permanent Magnet Motors

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Texas Instruments

Texas Instruments

День тому

Building on the previous session, we investigate the Field Oriented Control process in an easy to understand way using animations and simulations. We then introduce the topic of observers and how they can be applied in a field-oriented application to eliminate the motor shaft sensor, resulting in sensorless control.

КОМЕНТАРІ: 126
@felixre7
@felixre7 4 місяці тому
11 years now, still the best FOC explanation. I think at this point we can say this is the literally the best explanation humankind will ever have.
@diehardmetalhead3797
@diehardmetalhead3797 3 роки тому
After 8 years, still the best FOC explanation on the face of the internet. Great Job!!!
@gerrychen5656
@gerrychen5656 5 років тому
Amazing video - explained very dense material in a very easy to understand, logical, and practical way. Despite how intimidating a 53 minute long video can be, Dave did an amazing job of making the time fly by and I thoroughly enjoyed every minute.
@kimothefungenuis
@kimothefungenuis Рік тому
It's good this channel acknowledges that most of it's audience are engineers or engineering students
@harryhalfmoon
@harryhalfmoon 3 роки тому
I would give this ten thumbs up if I could. Absolutely fabulous seminar. Thank you Dave!
@yyunko7764
@yyunko7764 4 роки тому
oh my god, thank you some much Dave, this is an absolute masterpiece of teaching, just a great and short explanation of what seems immensely complex at first!
@TexasInstruments
@TexasInstruments 10 років тому
Hi Marc. The previous video in the series is on the topic of permanent magnet synchronous motors. We hope you find it helpful: Permanent Magnet AC Motors - Motor Control & How It Works
@byugrad1024
@byugrad1024 11 років тому
Amazing. Extremely well done. I feel like I could implement a vector controller in an FPGA now.
@Impedancenetwork
@Impedancenetwork 6 років тому
This is fascinating. I just took a controls and electric machines class. I'm taking a microprocessor class next semester so this video encompasses all those topics applied to the solution of a real problem. I'm going to have to watch this a couple more times.
@Impedancenetwork
@Impedancenetwork 7 років тому
Fantastic video. All these classes I take in my electrical engineering program and they never talk about the practical stuff that goes on everyday in the electrical world.
@esk8spirit362
@esk8spirit362 5 років тому
Welcome to college.
@gergelytakacs
@gergelytakacs 9 місяців тому
I wish I had teachers/professors like you. Hats off to you.
@surajg.7369
@surajg.7369 6 років тому
one of best tutorials ever seen.. great job !
@sewingmachinesindetail
@sewingmachinesindetail Місяць тому
Thank you for this amazing video about FOC. I have previously worked a bit with diesel generators and the control of them got some close similarities. They also use a synchronous generator (or machine), and when you connect it to the mains grid with, you control the power applied by the throttle of the diesel engine. When you increase the throttle, the diesel in some ways try to increase the frequency of the mains grid (but it will of cause not succeed in this situation). You control the reactive power applied to the mains by the changing the magnetization of the generator. In is a bit the same situation, than having two diesel generators in service on a ship. When you want to take one diesel out of service, you ramp up the power on the other generator, and in principle it could end by turning the other diesel generator around unless it is disconnected from the local grid. Your analysis show, that the control of a three phase inverter comes down to the same principles of control as the control a diesel generator.
@hassanak7
@hassanak7 5 років тому
Amazing video. I like the way how everything was explained step by step.
@reima8
@reima8 9 років тому
Thank you, thank you and one more time: Thank you. You are a great teacher.
@galenchai
@galenchai Рік тому
Thank you Dave. I really benefit a lot from your video!! I learn FOC in a very way by sitting on the sofa and watching your video, instead of studying papers in front of my desk and still don't understand what's going on...🤩
@farhanhafiz3096
@farhanhafiz3096 3 роки тому
i like when study any control system and the application is given. moreover u give us the hardware explanation and the example of controller. thank youu so much, i really love your explanation. hope you stay healthy and spread more your knowledge.
@Benz901123
@Benz901123 11 років тому
This is gold! Thank you so much
@honzaperoutka
@honzaperoutka 4 роки тому
Really great and useful presentation! Thank you, TI
@magyarandrastamas2485
@magyarandrastamas2485 4 роки тому
Amazing video, way better than my 5 years of electronic engineering studies at the university.
@shawnhue4386
@shawnhue4386 2 роки тому
2021 and can not find anything better. Thanks!
@dimchohvarchilkov683
@dimchohvarchilkov683 3 роки тому
An excellent video! A very good way of explanation! Thank you!
@MM-vq6sk
@MM-vq6sk 10 років тому
Awesome tutorial. Please keep it coming.
@robn2497
@robn2497 5 років тому
Thank you Texas Instruments I am starting to understand :) Very cool information.
@str8up598
@str8up598 Рік тому
This is what the internet SHOULD be. Great video. Makes me think.. I wish I understood all I know.
@caiofuccio5788
@caiofuccio5788 7 років тому
Very helpful tutorial. Thanks for sharing.
@elsnowman123
@elsnowman123 Рік тому
Great video. Exactly what I was looking for
@markgjunter3659
@markgjunter3659 3 роки тому
Great job! Thank you!
@wariskn7096
@wariskn7096 4 роки тому
Excellent Excellent Excellent.....Dale Wilson u made this so simple....
@jenskapmeyer2579
@jenskapmeyer2579 5 років тому
TI guys are the best ... thanks a lot for that video.
@th1alb
@th1alb 6 років тому
great video and really well explained
@BrittoEdwardVictor
@BrittoEdwardVictor 9 років тому
A nice tutorial thank you. Can you recommend some good books or articles on this?
@hassanebrahimi8713
@hassanebrahimi8713 8 років тому
Excellent tutorial.
@danielashbaugh9820
@danielashbaugh9820 4 роки тому
Great job!
@Kafi1986
@Kafi1986 6 років тому
this was so helpful for me, thank you very much :)
@inhibited44
@inhibited44 4 роки тому
6:52 is a nice explanation of vector math for current
@Debraj1978
@Debraj1978 10 років тому
Exactly. Even I was wondering the same.
@sheepman6291
@sheepman6291 4 роки тому
I look for months on how to do this.Thank you!
@giaoconhuynh7330
@giaoconhuynh7330 4 роки тому
Amazing video
@naveenreddy1010
@naveenreddy1010 Рік тому
Really Amazing video sir .
@tarunbajaj9091
@tarunbajaj9091 9 років тому
This is the most indept tutorial for pmsm i have found on the internet. Great video but may have to go through it a few more times u get all of it..
@dohafaris293
@dohafaris293 4 роки тому
Thank you so much , that's smart 💕✨
@ramchandrareddyatigadda8748
@ramchandrareddyatigadda8748 6 років тому
awesome tutorial
@adambodom
@adambodom 9 років тому
Hye Dave Do you have Induction motor speed control vids? By the way, what is the final objective of FOC; is it to control the speed of the motor slowly until it teaches the full speed?
@TexasInstruments
@TexasInstruments 8 років тому
Hi Nikola, The tool used for simulations in this video is LTSpice. The task of estimating the rotor flux vector in an AC induction machine is the subject of thousands of papers related to sensorless control of ACIMs, and is too involved to answer effectively in this venue. Texas Instruments offers a proprietary way to do this called InstaSPIN-FOC, which does this job very well. Learn more: www.ti.com/ww/en/mcu/instaspin/instaspin-foc.shtml However, if you are only interested in calculating the rated value of flux in an ACIM, you can use the following formulae: Rated flux (Webers) = (Rated RMS Voltage * sqrt(2/3) * Lm) / (2 * pi * line_frequency * Ls)
@nikolaradakovic5050
@nikolaradakovic5050 8 років тому
+Texas Instruments Many thanks. I wish to have a flexible system that will allow me to close the loop on my motion controller instead of servo drive which is a common practice. Can InstaSPIN or Design Drive suite be applied in robotics or CNC applications? How well AC induction motor compares with brushless DC in applications requiring precise positioning? Kind regards, Nikola
@TexasInstruments
@TexasInstruments 8 років тому
+Nikola Radakovic InstaSPINcomes in two basic variations; InstaSPIN-FOC and InstaSPIN-MOTION. Both implement a field oriented control algorithm. We typically see InstaSPIN-FOC used with sensorless applications, and InstaSPIN-MOTION used with sensored systems. Another way to look at the differences is that InstaSPIN-FOC is used primarily for speed control applications, and InstaSPIN-MOTION is used for position control applications. So for robotics and CNC applications, it sounds like InstaSPIN-MOTION might be a better fit. In regards to AC induction motors in position control applications, they can be a little more complicated to control due to the slip between rotor and rotor flux. As long as you use a shaft sensor, this solution can be implemented. However, I typically see permanent magnet machines used for servo applications (especially in sub-horsepower applications) due to the increased power density and smaller size possible.
@nikolaradakovic5050
@nikolaradakovic5050 8 років тому
+Texas Instruments I read your Users Guide InstaSPIN-FOC and InstaSPIN-Motion. Might I notice that Piccolo processor used in InstaSPIN is a MIPS one core CPU. In order to implement slave motors or parallel kinematics, I unfortunately don't see a way to apply simultaneous multitreading. Time slice threading on one core would cause inconsistent timing. As a result parallel axis would compete and cause internal strains like in a case of delta robot or gantry mill where we have two or more motors driving the same axis at the same time. However, I would like to ask you a few questions related to SpinTAC API , more precisely SpinTAC Plan . My idea is to make a post processor for G-Code and translate it for InstaSPIN . As far as I understood , you use a state machine for motion control.So in my case of G-Code, to move from a point A to point B I need to create two configuration states using a function STPOSPLAN_addCfgState(ST_POS_PLAN_Handle, int32_t, _iq24,int32_t) . Every transition from point n to point n+1 requires additional state. In that case my SpinTAC Position Plan would leak the memory of your CPU. Is it possible to load a position plan from external memory? What are the units of second and third argument of function STPOSPLAN_addCfgState(ST_POS_PLAN_Handle, int32_t, _iq24, int32_t) ? Documentation states that these two parameters are called PostStepInt_mrev and PostStepFrac_mrev.How do we determine the values of PostStepInt_mrev and PostStepFrac_mrev ? Many thanks, Nikola
@EETechs
@EETechs 8 років тому
+Texas Instruments Where is Dave Wilson's 10 part series and mathematical proof papers? I cannot find them on site www.ti.com/motorblog.
@circuitdotlt
@circuitdotlt 8 місяців тому
Did I understand correctly that this will work well with non-sinusoidal bemf? Also how do you deal with very high erpm, like 150k, which is higher than 10kHz observer? And how about sensorless start under load in EV application?
@natezimmer4489
@natezimmer4489 8 років тому
whoa, LTSpice and not Tina? Neat video, thanks for sharing!
@danielsanichiban
@danielsanichiban 5 років тому
TI bought LT before this vid
@atahghighi
@atahghighi 7 років тому
Questio! The input to the top sigma block has to be the stimated position , but it's gotten from wrong place. Am I right?
@byugrad1024
@byugrad1024 11 років тому
Did you make some of those LTSpice components yourself? If not, can you point me to where you found them?
@akkudakkupl
@akkudakkupl 2 роки тому
About section on the observer - isn't the rotor angle just simply arctan(BEMFa/BEMFb)? Ergo not needing any complicated demodulation in software? Also do we need to measure our alpha and beta voltages, or can we just take them straight from inverse Park transformation that is fed to the inverter?
@chassismate
@chassismate 7 років тому
Hi Wilson. What if I control motor pole 2. 4. 8 in automatically?
@adricat59
@adricat59 5 років тому
Does anybody know which is the angle that is used in the reverse park transformation for the two correction voltages? The measured or the ones you actually have?
@avikrajnitdgp
@avikrajnitdgp 7 років тому
where can i get a video explaining the field oriented control in a Permanent Magnet Synchronous Generator
@LeonidKorobeynikov
@LeonidKorobeynikov 9 років тому
Great! Do you have this video in better resolution?
@ethanlin8332
@ethanlin8332 6 років тому
I have one question for the system model at time 45:40: We get -K*sin and K*cos, then why do you multiply them cos and sin? In the next step, we get -2K*sin*cos, which is nothing to do with wn and angle.....
@khalidMohammed-dg2fi
@khalidMohammed-dg2fi 8 років тому
thank u Texas instruments. Can I buy complete FOC or V/f system, How much money do they cost?
@ThePanthersdkfz
@ThePanthersdkfz 6 років тому
Thank you
@RathodDharmin
@RathodDharmin 6 років тому
Can I use the same approach for BLDC ?
@misan2006
@misan2006 8 років тому
Great tutorial. It's a pity resolution is so low.
@DehimVerveen
@DehimVerveen 6 років тому
Do you really need any extra resolution for this presentation?
@franciskatende1566
@franciskatende1566 4 роки тому
@@DehimVerveen 2yrs later, please ask him that question again
@harryhalfmoon
@harryhalfmoon 3 роки тому
@@DehimVerveen Another summer came and went and we're still waiting for the answer. Miguel, give us a sign of life! For the love of Christ!
@mkacytchannel
@mkacytchannel 8 місяців тому
I have a .38HP bldc motor drive and hall sensor damage is it possible to run the motor with vfd.
@mohitbhola7104
@mohitbhola7104 4 роки тому
Sir can this same be apply to the Permanent Magnet Generator torque control i.e. controlling load on the primemover?
@ddegn
@ddegn 3 роки тому
Is there an updated motor control kit to take the place of TMDS1MTRPFCKIT?
@dkeall1
@dkeall1 11 років тому
Excellent lecture. Can you come and teach at my university?
@nikolaradakovic5050
@nikolaradakovic5050 8 років тому
Extremely useful video. By the way, how do we estimate flux for asynchronous induction machine?
@khalidMohammed-dg2fi
@khalidMohammed-dg2fi 8 років тому
+Nikola Radakovic Dear Nikola, Read chapter 34, Electrical Technology book, authored by Theraja
@pablitosax
@pablitosax 6 років тому
Very good video, but for better understanding could you add the subtitles of youtube?
@PowerON-Tech
@PowerON-Tech 3 роки тому
Great presentation, enjoyed it a lot. Can the LTSpice files be accessed somewhere?
@dadamkd
@dadamkd 3 роки тому
e2e.ti.com/support/archive/motor/m/spice
@baderaldeennofal6033
@baderaldeennofal6033 8 років тому
thanks
@lauronunes7832
@lauronunes7832 Рік тому
In the 21:20 time section, I see Id and flux commands loose on the diagram. Only commanded Iq is connected?
@Cannabic
@Cannabic 5 місяців тому
Could you please upload again this video with a higher quality? thanks
@PlanetPresident
@PlanetPresident 5 років тому
Do you have a unit that is plug &play, I built a new type of power generator that uses a LG Direct Drive washing machine motor(BLDC) as its primary Driver. what I need is a controller to control the speed of the unit, something ready to connect to my 3 phase wires and to a power source(12v, 120v or 240v).
@tebbotebbo309
@tebbotebbo309 4 роки тому
the LTspice simulation files , where can i get a link to them ???
@luunguyenang6160
@luunguyenang6160 4 роки тому
the rotor speed is equal to the synchronous speed which is 50 Hz in my country. you need to change the synchronous speed to change the rotor speed. look at FOC control strategy for permanent magnet synchronous motor, i can't figure it out how this can change the frequency. Can any engineer here explain this for me? I'd appreciate that!
@chehar
@chehar 6 років тому
Is this not Direct Torque Control?
@mazhar214
@mazhar214 3 роки тому
Can u please make a video on voltage oriented control and direct power control of pwm rectifiers
@gtoonstra
@gtoonstra 9 років тому
Could you tell us which simulator program is being used around 40 minutes?
@TexasInstruments
@TexasInstruments 9 років тому
Thanks for your question. The simulation program used was LTSpice.
@adrishchatterjee8954
@adrishchatterjee8954 7 років тому
Where can we get the slides?
@malap123
@malap123 7 років тому
May we know, why u are using LT Spice rather than Tina
@WildMan7856
@WildMan7856 7 років тому
LT Spice is built from the ground up to deal with discontinuities. Therefore, LT Spice is great for this since it uses PWM signals.
@chehar
@chehar 7 років тому
This is amazing. How can this you-tube video be referenced for my thesis?
@TexasInstruments
@TexasInstruments 7 років тому
Thank you! You should follow any guidelines from your instructor on what style to use to list video resources. Good luck!
@husseinshutari5209
@husseinshutari5209 3 роки тому
awesome video. but I have a question, in time 0f 17:30, How the PI controller converts the error signal into Vd? thank you in advance
@mohammadrezaadib8999
@mohammadrezaadib8999 3 роки тому
it doesn't convert! in fact these signal haven't any unit. these are just numbers that we define and label
@youssefsalimi7473
@youssefsalimi7473 5 років тому
very well explained sir.
@red_juan
@red_juan 3 роки тому
So technically, FOC is NOT used for Brushless DC motors ??
@KieranEboard
@KieranEboard 6 років тому
can someone tell me, if I have a hall sensor in my BLDC and I drive my motor by Sinusoidal wave current, can I say that I am using FOC?
@TexasInstruments
@TexasInstruments 6 років тому
Hi Kieran: Our experts in the motor drivers E2E community may be able to help with questions on FOC. e2e.ti.com/support/applications/motor_drivers/
@JKDPowerandEnergySolutions
@JKDPowerandEnergySolutions 3 роки тому
Nonlinear Speed Control for PMSM System Using Sliding-Mode Control & Disturbance Compensation UKposts demonstration: ukposts.info/have/v-deo/aJGaqWtnfIOSyp8.html High-speed Sliding mode observer: ukposts.info/have/v-deo/hJukiKCJg6h0taM.html
@jjmvos7894
@jjmvos7894 5 років тому
Slide 4: *Kirchhoff's law
@saraf3306
@saraf3306 7 років тому
On the slide 4, if current Ic is equal to the negative sum of currents Ia and Ib, shouldn't the net current be zero?
@QSQCaito
@QSQCaito 7 років тому
Yes, the net current has to be zero. Whatever is entering through phase A and B MUST come out of phase C. If not there would be charge accumulation.
@surajg.7369
@surajg.7369 6 років тому
I agree net current is zero then "Is" value is zero all the time .How it can drive the motor then ?
@QSQCaito
@QSQCaito 6 років тому
When you plug something on the wall, on your socket the net current is also zero. What comes through one cable leaves through the other. Still you can use the fridge, laptop, etc.. Make sure you understand that first
@surajg.7369
@surajg.7369 6 років тому
Oh right one of them serves as a return path after load.. didn't strike at that moment..Thank you.
@maynardr6
@maynardr6 11 років тому
Time to give all my friends more unsolicited knowledge about motors again. They are gonna be soooo bored, but if you're gonna be friends with a geek, you gotta accept the whole package.
@alexlo7708
@alexlo7708 2 роки тому
17.00 How can current I pass to the PI integrator then become V voltage? No any physical circuit approved that. Any knowledge I pass R-resistor by multiplying value , So given V-voltage, I pass C-capacitor by integrator I , So given V- voltage and I pass L-inductor by differentiated I , So given V-voltage. Or you don't know PI controller has automatically changed I to V without any description.
@fadymmoussa
@fadymmoussa 11 років тому
can i use field oriented control on a permenant magnet synchronous generator???
@GreenTechValidation
@GreenTechValidation 2 роки тому
i think you can
@ElectricalAndElectronics
@ElectricalAndElectronics 7 років тому
#EEE
@pacerodi
@pacerodi 5 років тому
I guess, the moto is: - Why simplify, when, we can complicate it. Nowadays, we can run a 3 phase motor, with a mosfet(s), and a voltage regulator.
@ferriswhitehouse1476
@ferriswhitehouse1476 4 роки тому
Texas instruments is the best
@wariskn7096
@wariskn7096 4 роки тому
So I have some questions, please correct me with that issue as soon as possible as it is so important for me. 1. In our step2 what is the desired current actually ment for is it my reference current which I have provided(let's say 20A) or is it the desired current at the point which should be 90deg to the rotor flux at given period of time(u said it is like that and after sometime you have mentioned about car throttle that is the desired current)..So I am Little bit confused. 2.the d axis is take from the rotor position right so we will get an angle so, what will be the desired angle axis at that point, how we will identify it(we will know the angle from sensor,but the desired will be what) 3 in that video we are inputing the desired speed(proportional to torque and current there will be speed right) so is this will be desired speed compare with the actual speed or is it calculating at the moment at which measured d axis flux should be 0 with respect to the actual flux angle as both are on same reference (As we are measuring with rotating frame of reference we only magnitude not angle). Please correct me with this issue Dale....m so much concerned about it right now...if anybody knows what I am trying to say please resolve my issue..right now I am working with FOC and m facing this trouble.
@alexlo7708
@alexlo7708 2 роки тому
I think the post part in clip is some description of sensorless vector control, In case they didn't have rotor position sensor to tell the angle at all. Or may be he use estimated angle from calculation as a feed forward angle in model observer. Actually say, he make use estimated rotor angle to calculate desired torque current instead of real angle from rotor sensor as an excuse that sensor always give lagging value on anytime. So he forwarding estimated it and use them instead.
@jithinsankar
@jithinsankar 3 роки тому
മലയാളികൾ ഉണ്ടെൽ like adi
@ivan868
@ivan868 10 років тому
Quality is too low!
@hisheighnessthesupremebeing
@hisheighnessthesupremebeing 9 місяців тому
Bookmark 19
@chrisdrake9160
@chrisdrake9160 4 роки тому
The idea "regulate current" is spoken a hundred times, but I'm 99.9% sure that no such thing happens - FETS don't regulate current. This Video needs a preliminary explanation of how an ON/OFF silicon switch is used through PWM to *approximate* a method for current regulation... 5 amps for 1 second is the same as 10 amps for half a second... well - no it is not, but, if you make that time shorter and shorter, you end up with something that comes somewhat close to what you want... but involves wasted heat and lost torque the faster you try to do that... Personally - I think FOC is just plain wrong. All that math only makes sense in theory - as soon as you try to apply it in the real world, it all breaks down from wrong assumptions, shortcuts, and mistaken timing choices. We should NOT be trying to program a "blind" ESC to output what we think is probably the right phase signals - we SHOULD be programming a "smart" ESC to optimise what it is delivering to meet what we are asking for (typically max RPM for Min current (boats/planes) or max torque for constant current (cars/skateboards)), and the ESC itself should be continuously performing micro-adjustments to output ideal optimal signals without involving any human assumptions (you know - those hundreds of numbers you need to program into your ESC software for anything to work - we should not be giving it *any* numbers, it should work it ALL out itself).
@bajrangiyadav4351
@bajrangiyadav4351 2 роки тому
mm
@robertlake2753
@robertlake2753 4 роки тому
Can't afford conventional circuit simulators? Spot: androidcircuitsolver/app.html
@Omarbg95
@Omarbg95 3 роки тому
This video gives me a headache, i thought it was going to be easy but it's not.
@stanislavsubrt886
@stanislavsubrt886 2 роки тому
Great presentation. Thanks a lot! I have seen it already like five times and Im definitely going to watch it again :)
@pedrovelazquez138
@pedrovelazquez138 3 роки тому
Thank you
@vivekpant9912
@vivekpant9912 4 роки тому
thanks
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