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We built a house in Vermont. Occupied it in October 2019. Had a total of 20 PV panels on 3 sections of roof. 10 face south, 5 east and 5 west. Max generation is 400 watts per panel. Cost was $23000. In 2023 we finished a separate 3 car garage. Last fall we added 22 440 watt panels on the south facing roof and 2 Tesla Powerwalls. The Tesla control panel is awesome and can full control from the Tesla app. Before tax credit the was $46,000. An unplanned expense was $7500 for the electric company to furnish and install a 25 kW transformer to replace the existing 10 kW one. We got a 30% federal tax credit on the whole cost. Up here we don’t get as much sun as we would want, but we still get power even on some rainy days. On those good days we charge the batteries and run the house on solar during the day and batteries at night. Excess goes to the grid. Chargers our cars the same way. We don’t dare about payback. It’s an investment in preserving our planet, which is payback enough.

As an Australian I can confirm - my 7kw solar system cost $8k installed before subsidies, which reduced it to $4k. My solar system has already paid for itself after 4 years.

Florida resident and solar home owner here. I used to pay around $350 to $400/month for my electric consumption but that was 4 years ago when electricity was 10 cents/kWh. I told septics costs typically go up significantly each year, something people tend to scoff at as hype for solar. In fact I was skeptical. But here we are today at $16 cents/kWh. I calculated my break even at 10 to 12 years based on the 10 cent rate. Another thing people overlook was best expressed by Ben Franklin, “a penny saved is a penny earned”. My solar investment is returning close to 8% in “savings” or earnings depending on how you look at it. Had you invested that money in a bond, for example, the 8% return would be taxable. The return on your solar investment is tax free. Not only that, because of the 25% federal tax credit I was able use IRA money that would have not only been taxed as income but would have counted to increase the amount of SS income taxable effectively tax free. Plus in FL there is no sales tax on solar equipment or labor. Add to that the increase in the value of your home attributed to solar is not assessable by property taxes. Critics can say what they want but often it’s politically motivated. My feeing is criticize all you want while I laugh all the way to the bank.

The fact that solar installation is mired in so many details related permits, installation, configurations and cost, makes your channel and others more valuable.

Its not just the USA that has issues on solar installation costs. Here in Atlantic Canada, electric installation of any sort are subject to an inspection of, get this, LABOUR costs, and if the installer does not charge the IBEW rates they can lose their LICENSE to operate in the area. Its simply ridiculous, especially when the power utility inspectors enforce IBEW rules.....They are employed by the POWER utility, not the IBEW, and should therefore be required to simply inspect the quality of the job that it conforms to local and national codes, NOT IBEW rules. Sorry for the rant, here. Love your videos, Matt!

Hi, Aussie solar installer here. I think one of the largest drivers of the price disparity between US and Oz is the effect of Chinese overproduction of panels. Here we have cheap Chinese manufactured panels flooding the market and driving the price down. It's gotten to the extent that a number of good manufacturers have pulled out of the country because they can no longer compete. The US however have tariffs on panels not produced in North America so y'all don't have the intense competition that has come from the Chinese overproduction of panels. Panel prices here have dropped about 30% in the past 12 months. While it's a damn shame to lose these higher quality manufacturers one can hardly complain about solar power getting even cheaper. Yet we still have people here pushing for nuclear. Wild times.

I haven’t crunched the numbers or figured out exactly how much it would cost, but last time we were quoted on solar, it would have cost around $40000, that was a few years ago. I just keep hearing that solar panels have gotten exponentially cheaper over the years, so when the price to install a solar system doesn’t budge or gets more expensive over time, it really feels like a scam. Add to that the supposed decrease in battery costs yet being quoted $12000 for a single battery which goes on top of that cost and it really feels like a scam. And there’s always something odd going on with the installation companies and I don’t trust them. Again, it’s probably more of a feeling than something legitimate, but the fact that it feels shady and the fact that prices aren’t going down with the cost of materials makes me feel like it’s not worth it at all.

I've had solar panels on my house since 2019. The company that installed them also sold me on better insulation, which cost a lot and didn't make much difference in heat/cooling losses. As an Oregon resident, any extra annual solar energy that is generated is given away once a year, and residents are not allowed to build systems that would generate more than your average annual usage. We also still have to pay a flat $12+ monthly fee to be connected to the grid--a fact no one told me before I had the panels installed. All that said, I wish I could have more solar panels, and I plan to install a battery wall eventually (but not from Tesla and not while it costs $20k).

A huge factor of solar "being a scam" is how these resellers rip you off charging at least 4x on the panels so you're better off buying your own materials. Even the batteries. They're basically adult legos. Tesla powerwall is $13,000 and stores 13.5kWh. You can pickup the cells to make a 14.3 (I'm discharge testing 16.1kWh) for $1,640 +tax&ship

Great job on breaking down the comments Matt. Your viewing of this from a broader view is what makes this channel so good. No bias.

Thank you for your tactful approach to criticism. I personally appreciate the structured, informative design of your videos, drawn from your personal experiences and research. Even if you have additional motive for compensations through promotions and ad revenue, you still provide favorable information in unbiased ways that can be incredibly valuable for your viewers. Plus, you meticulously cite your resources.

Awesome video, you answered the exact question I had on the other one! It’s amazing how much the soft costs impact the overall price. Always cool to understand the why thank you!

In my state, net metering rules makes solar not worth it, UNLESS you go COMPLETELY off grid and disconnect. You buy power at $0.1-0.12/kw-h. They buy from you at $0.023/kw-h. You pay grid connection/maintenance fees. Essentially you need to sell 4x more than you use + 2000 kw-h to cover the fees. I'm building a new house next year. Ultra energy efficient. I'll put solar on my garage roof and install enough battery capacity to completely disconnect. Put in a really nice backup generator just incase.

*Here in Florida, every 10 years your homeowner's insurance company is going to INSIST that a new roof be installed or their coverage will be negated by them refusing to underwrite the roof replacement for any hurricane loss. *Your mortgage carrier will then be FORCED by their underwriters to gain insurance elsewhere to cover their loan on your property. *Then charging you for the cost & they're not in the least bit concerned with cost, either. *With the piercing of the roof by installing the PV cells you've just faulted the moisture barrier & subsequently the warranty of your roof. *Congratulations! *You as the proud homeowner get to underwrite your own roof warranty &, further, hope that your morgage holder doesn't find out about your PV install. *Enjoy your lower electricity bill. *Plus the fact that you have to reinstall new panels every 10-20 years for the next newer, faster, prettier, shinier more efficient models that will no doubt be coming to your door via some young college kid selling his way through college. *Why? Because you've got "Stupid Rich" written all over your roof. *Congratulations!

Built our own 4400 sqft off grid home couple years ago now. Solar was much cheaper than having power run to the house. We have all the amenities of any other house. Not a big deal, wish more people would do it.

I agree 100% on what you said about region. I work in the solar industry on the sales side for a national company and pricing is VERY different based on where you live. MOST places the math works out for the consumer, some... not so much

We got a 13Kw solar panel system installed about 18 months ago and overall I am happy with it. It works as advertised and generates about 97% of the energy we use in a year. We got ripped off on the cost though. In my area the only way to get one is through a vendor that includes installation. The real issue is the power utility won’t even speak with you unless your from one of those companies. So we paid about twice what it would have cost to buy all the components on the open market. The cost was really disappointing because I am a professional electrical engineer and the actual design and wiring for the system isn’t complicated. So I paid someone something I should have done myself. Screw the power company and permitting agency lol.

Just FYI, when you are talking about hard costs & soft costs, Labor is not considered a soft cost. It a part of the construction numbers of building. When you do pro-forma's for buildings, construction/install labor is not in the soft cost category.

Really good video !!! I was one of the ones that pointed out the cost in US is staggeringly high, and you are totally right, we should consider ourselves lucky if we live in a country where prices are not so marked up by all the little things, as you experience in your local area. I got solar REALLY cheap, cause I live in a place where it's low cost AND i had a part of it DIY'ed.

Another great video and very informative - thank you! Looking at the overview of the house, it would seem like an ideal area to start a self-sustaining food garden as well!

I have grid tied solar - 5.25kW system on a ground mount installed in SW Colorado through a non-profit organization Solar Barn Raising who uses "pay it forward" installation with volunteer labor. In four years, last month I paid my first charge for electricity of about $8 for a month of snowy/rainy days. Yes, I pay $35 each month for a grid tie charge, but except that month, zero cost for electricity. My system cost about $9000 total. Our cost of grid electricity here is $0.095 per kWH. Best investment I could have made with my money!!!!!

Applying Bayesian rules to objectively judge UKposts comments is why you're a winner Mr. Matt Ferrell! Thanks for sneaking that 1 line in. It lets us in on your processes and not just your tools of analysis!

This type of level headed thinking, analysis, and explanation are why I watch this channel. Most people would just respond "Shut up, trolls!" to these types of comments, but he approaches it like an actual adult. Not many of us adults act like adults nowadays 😅

From what I can tell, it costs way less per KWH when the power is generated in large solar farms where the equipment is kept cleaned, maintained, and updated. Rooftop systems often have hidden costs and problems... so they could seem scammy, depending on the situation.

I had my 5.8KW system installed in 2016. I got break even in less than two years because of my two EVs. However, in the past two years, Southern California Edision reduced the power buy back price from 36 cents to 9 cents (at one point of time, it was down to 3 cents). Now, I own SCE $2,000+ annually. I am making free energy for SCE. I need a battery system for my electricity production. I want to get myself totally off the grid. Utility companies are evil.

One thing that was not addressed in this video are for those Solar owners that do not have a battery. What about cost of delivery for electricity? Do you have a good electric plan? Do you have a good buy back program? Because even though you are generating electricity during the day when you are not home, it just gets sent to the grid. And during the night when you are home, you will be pulling electricity from the grid - and paying cost per watt on that + delivery charges. For most people going solar, they aren't buying a battery because the main goal for most people are to reduce their monthly cost and to secure that cheaper monthly cost for years whereas price for energy will keep going up.

Wow, what a great video: Very balanced and well-researched! It took a lot of work and time to create this video!

I haven't paid an electric bill for 13 years. Mine paid for itself about 5-6 years ago. The scammers are the ones who finance it when you could get lower interest with tax deductable heloc.

I live in the Netherlands and we've just had our panels installed couple of months back. We have a very small south-facing roof, so it is only four panels, generating 1.5kWh at max. There is no storage (yet), so our "solar array" is connected to the grid and we are billed for what we've consumed minus what was generated. The full cost of the setup including installation was 3400 EUR. Our electricity provider (who did not have any part in installation) estimates that we would be paying at least 500 EUR less annually. The red tape amount is basically zero. There were no permit required for installation because I do not live in a "protected cityscape" plus the panels are not visible from the street. As an owner of installation, I had to register my setup at some grid operators' registry, but it is quite easy as it is and my installer filled in most of the details anyway. P.S.: our electricity consumption is very small - around 5 kWh per day as our heating is non-electric (yet) and we do not have an AC

Ordered my System on a Monday, installed on a Friday. Operating by Midday. Sun most days of the year. Welcome to Australia!

My wife and I live off-grid. We love it. No rebates, no nothing. We simply wanted to be more independent. When the neighborhood goes black there's our home, all lit up. We never really know that there's a utility failure unless it's after dark. Would we do it again? Absolutely!

I am a DIY'er who designed / installed a 10KwH system on my home in southern NH for about $1 per watt back in 2016. I filed all the paperwork, applied for the permits & designed the system (string inverter style) and installed on my roof. Actual out of pocket was $20K but the incentives at the time paid for literally half. Win-win situation at the time. System maintains near 100 percent of what it produced since day one and I'm quite happy with it as it covers `00 percent of my electrical usage. But ... Today, those same incentives have reduced somewhat. NH does not give the same rebate incentive and you cannot get "Net Metering 1" anymore, but I would do it again today regardless! However, I would never hire a 3rd party solar installer. The only persons who gain from this are the installers themselves.

Matt, I have always liked how you approach analysis - answers are only easy when the underlying nuance is ignored or glossed over. Your analysis doesn't shy away from complexity, making it far more useful for those of us who don't need and don't want dumbed down info.

Another thing to note. In my area, you were not eligible for any incentives, if you did the install yourself. It had to be done by a qualified installer.

I’m a working class guy. I had a 3.5 k system installed five years ago. One thing I’m very happy about is the inflationary savings. The energy my panels produce has not gone up in price in all the time I’ve owned them.

I'm in Queensland, paid $2900 for 6.6kw system in August 2021. My quarterly bill is roughly $300. Next quarter I will have broken even (as the previous provider dropped their feed in rate) Over summer my house hold used 510Kw and generated 2110Kw and I currently have $400 dollars in credits with the energy provider. From here on in its all savings and its nice not having another bill sneak up on me. Our hot water is gas so a big usage of power is taken out which helps and gas being cheap its not a big deal. The so called scams here are the pay over time installers, the interest and extra fees make it cost far more in the long run.

And the lights all went out in Massachusetts But was left standing on my own , warm and dry ...... or at least that's how i remember the song we sang at school about solar power

@Matt, I had a leased grid connected Solar system from Solar City. There was no out of pocket expense. Lease included panels, hw, licenses, and install. The overall power expenses for power including the lease was cut in half from the non-solar system. It was a great deal. I did not have any issue selling the home later on.

To be a counter voice to the negatives: I went solar about a year ago mostly thanks to this channel, and have been very happy so far! Massive electricity savings and just overall quite happy. Additionally my dad quickly went solar after me. And he's got 30+ years experience in contracts and supply chain. He knows a scam or even just a bad deal when he sees it and he still went solar and is quite happy.

I installed my solar myself to all the required standards with quality equipment, and I hired an electrician to do the work that I legally couldn't do myself. I reckon it ended up costing me no less than if I had an installer do all of it. But I learnt a lot in the process, and I ended up with exactly the system I wanted. Now I am commissioning grid scale solar farms as part of my job, so the stuff I learnt on my own system ended up being useful

Hi Matt, Adam from Australia here. You're right we are lucky! but it's not just the soft costs of solar, the panels and install are relatively cheap. I paid about usd$8k for a 10Kw system!

I have a small portable solar setup, that "augments" my current garage power usage. The main benefit is the risk of a power outage, as we live in a rural area with outages lasting much longer than the city folk endure. Not sure can put an ROI value on security. Nice video can't wait to see your long term review.

I find it hard finding a company that isn't doing a fast sell wishy washy pitch that is all scam once you dig into the contract.

The most important variable to determine if solar is right for you is 'do you want to do the research, legwork and investment into upgrading your home or would you prefer to stay plugged in and leave it to utility companies ?' The extra work isn't everyone's cup of tea and as long as they don't discourage others or actively work against green energy interests, its a fair stance.

I live in Hawaii, which is pretty much the gold standard for "Solar makes sense here". I installed a 10.2kW Solar panel + 26kWhr battery (2xTesla Powerwalls) in Oct 2021. The total cost for the system (Including hardware , labor, permits, etc) was $40.1k. Hawaii has generous state tax credits, and the 26%(I think) at the time federal tax credit means my outlay was $20k. This system has produced 38.7MWhr of power in it's lifetime, and our household use has been 33.9MWhr over the same period (according to the Tesla App, which has always been within 1% of the calibrated meters from the power company, and the production meter on the solar (also calibrated)). Hawaii has a high per kWh cost of power that fluctuates every month, from a low of around 33 cents, to a high of about 50 cents (Hawaii gets a lot of it's electric from oil, and the oil cost is a direct pass thru to the customer). So while the math gets complicated, the system has almost already paid itself off after 3 years, for sure by the end of next year. In addition the batteries have held us over an eleven hour power outage, and a few shorter ones. About 90% of the time we are running "off-grid". Two more batteries (another $20k) would get us to 99%, and then an additional 2 batteries would get us to ~99.5%. Hawaii hasn't had net metering for almost ten years now, so those extra 5MWhr have netted us minimal returns, the key is to be able to run 24/7 off your solar and batteries. Long story short, it's well worth it in Hawaii. I do think Matt overpaid for his system, and I wonder what the cost would have been directly thru Tesla, which claims to have no commissioned sales folks. I know in Hawaii people have a similar system to mine (including Tesla brand gateway and batteries) have paid more because they wanted to go thru a local contractor and not Tesla directly. Also, while I think Elon is a jerk, I think the Tesla engineers have done a good job on their products.

I am in "Sunny Southern California" so things work out a bit different. I had my initial 4.8 KW Enphase grid tied system installed almost 5 years ago. Plans, permitting, inspection, and labor were all a bit more than the national average, but the installer took care of it all and made the process very smooth. I had saved up and paid for the system directly. It was in 3 payments. 20% down for them to order the equipment and start the paperwork. Another 30% when all the gear was delivered and they started installing it. The final 50% once the system was producing power. My total cost up front was $17,000 USD and it qualified for the 30% tax credit, so I got back over $5,000 the following April. Final out of pocket cost is then $12,000 for 4,800 watts of solar panels. Due to the Sunny location, my small 4,800 watts has produced 8,000 kilowatt hours each year. The 4th year fell just under 8,000 due to more cloudy weather, but the 5th year is looking good for over 8,000 again. At an average cost of $0.32 per KWH from the utility (rates go from $0.27 to $0.69 depending on time of year and time of day) that means I am "saving" over $2,500 a year off of my electric bill. $12,000 / 2,500 = 4.8 years to fully pay off the system. But it's not quite that simple. The one thing none of the Solar Companies mentioned when I got quotes was that the electric billing was going to change. Before I had solar panels, I was on a tired power billing schedule. The first 300 KWHs a month was only billed at $0.17 per KWH. The Second tier was up to about 1,000 KWHs at $0.26 per KWH. And then "High Usage" beyond that was at something like $0.40 per KWH. I used under 500 KWHs in winter months, and up to 1,800 KWHs in 100+ summer heat. My bills ran from a low of about $70 to a peak high of $500. The total for a year would end up around $3,000 for electricity. My PV Solar power system went online in late July, 2019. The first few bills looked amazing. Just $6, then $8 and $7. Just wow. This is amazing. And it's crazy hot and the A/C has not stopped running. But then I saw the little box on page 5 of the electric bill. I am on a yearly "True Up Plan". I am only paying the taxes and "Non-bypassable Charges". The energy is being added up. At the end of the first billing year, I was hit with a $1,500 bill for the energy I used from the grid. Adding in the monthly fees to the True Up and I ended up saving less than 30% off of my year of bills from before I got solar. The pay off was really going to be more like 12 years. The main culprit here was "Time of Use" billing. Sure, I was getting "100% credit for exported power". BUT... All my power export was between 10 am and 2 pm. Smack in the middle of the cheapest time of day rate. That cheapest rate is now $0.27 or more than tier 2 used to be. But this is credit to me. But after 4 pm, and on to 9 pm, as the sun goes down, the rate jumps up to $0.52 per KWH as the solar panels stop producing and you have to buy electricity. OUCH!!! This was never explained. Had I known about that, I would have installed more solar panels and a battery system to provide evening power. This was not so much a scam as it was just, not giving all the details. Had I gone any smaller, my bills might have actually gone up. By the end of year 2, I had a hybrid inverter installed with 18 KWHs of battery. Originally it was setup to just store 10 KWHs when the sun was up, during the cheap time of day, and then discharge that 10 KWH's back into the grid at 2 kw for the 5 hours from 4 pm to 9 pm. That change cut my electric bill in half. I now use almost no high rate power, and most days still export some at the cheap rate. Adding the cost of the batteries and the hybrid inverter, the pay off time still got shorter with the new savings, but I also got backup power essentially for free.

The electricity produced on an overcast day was what surprised me the most when I started charging my car at work with their solar panels on the roof. It produces somewhere around 200kWh on clear days but still enough to charge two cars at 11kW in parallel on overcast days.

In 2017 I self installed a 8.2kw solar system. Since then it has produce between 95% and 100% of my electric needs each year. Did I mention that I also have an EV, electric riding lawn mower, all electric tools, welders and I live in high desert environment..., so a fairly heavy electric user. Total cost for the system was about $16k . After tax credits, the solar investment should be paid off in about 7-10 years and that is with the relatively low cost of electricity in the NW US. I installed solar primarily to reduce, or fix the cost of electricity in retirement, which it has done, so I am happy with my decision. My total electric bill last year was about $100 so solar basically eliminated a bill in retirement which is one less thing to worry about.

Of course you made sure you are not getting ripped off. The problem I have with solar is that others (people NOT installing solar) are getting ripped off! No-interest state loans, state subsidies and net metering all disperse the actual cost of solar installations to all power grid consumers...

1. I also confirm. Even overcast days my panels are charging the batteries. I have overcast days that I don’t even draw from the electricity company. 2. For me, when we originally installed the whole system, the break even was like 30 years. It was marginal from a financial sense. But we went ahead anyway because our goal is to switch one of the cars to EV. Years later, the electric company has raised prices, to the point that the break even has shortened significantly. Looking at my neighbors’ $300-$400 monthly bills, my $30 felt justified. 3. We aren’t rich but it is about whether you can or cannot spent the money now. That is absolutely true. If you can’t spend the money now, even if it makes financial sense, you wouldn’t be able to do it. That’s a fact. 4. DIY is a personal thing. I don’t even touch electrical and plumbing. I rather pay for someone who I can go back to if something goes wrong. Not to mention I really don’t want to burn my house down. Paying for professionals, in my mind, is completely worth it. 5. Nothing to add on #5. The only thing I can compare to is how much I would have paid over time if I don’t have it. Incidentally, this year, the neighborhood has been having a lot of power outages. Our house has none. We both work from home. From a peace of mind standpoint, this setup is so worth it. Yes yes, it will be years before we cross the break even line. But we will.

I did solar with solarcity back in 2014. I got a 0.0 lease for 20 years. I paid nothing up front, and nothing for the installation. I am in california, and I don't own the panels on my roof, I own the power they create. My monthly payment to the solar company is $79.86 per month. It equalized my bills in the heavy use months, and all the power I get from the system is less than what the power company charges. I am connected to the grid, and have a good net metering contract. Probably better than you can get in most areas. Overall happy with the set up.

Median home price in the US: $426k Median home price in my town in Silicon Valley: $2.6m Pointing out regional price differences is nonsensical. Even within the same area, I've gotten quotes to build a garage ranging from $200-500k. Solar is similarly outrageously expensive here.... But then again, when we're paying $0.73 / kWh... As you said, everyone needs to do their due diligence to figure out if it's worth it or not. Lots of factors.

Thanks for this great explanation. Location is everything. Our main motivation to get solar was to be energy independent. While everyone can look forward to the US getting the prices down, but we weren't interested in waiting till that happens. We've had it (14 kw Tesla system) for several years now, with 3 batteries and eventually got an electric car. Very happy with the process and the results. Our electric bill is $14 per month.

Hi Matt, We installed 16 solar panels [LG 425W], Tesla power [13.2kWh] and a 5kWh inverter based on information available in your videos and availability in the NZ Solar Market, the total cost was NZ$34,000. Knowing that the cost of living is in NZ is higher than Aussie and average earnings are lower it still a huge amount [so solar is for the rich will partly hold]. My research showed that the system will have a ROI of 15 years, but this could be halved when electricity prices are increasing [something that is expected]. We pay 22c NZ$ per kWh and receive an 17c NZ$ per kWh rebate if we deliver to the national gird. We locked ourselves in with a contract for 5 years with our powerco regarding kWh cost paid/rebate. Running everything on electricity [Heating, Water, cooking] incl 2 PHEVs we think is has been worth the investment. Our annual power cost has been more or less equal over the last 18 years, whilst converting everything from natural gas to electricity. Thanks for you useful insights. Cheers

I had an 8kw solar system installed a year ago now (Brisbane Australia). Cost me about $8500 for the install and my power bill has gone from about $3000 per annum to about $800, so the payoff will be a bit under 4 years. The important part is load shifting as much of your usage to the daytime as possible. I have a pool and old school electric element hot water that soak up some of the excess solar during the days. I also set my dishwasher to run during the day and sometimes batch cook on the weekends during the day to microwave at night as nuking dinner uses a lot less power than the electric stovetop! I could possibly reduce the power bill a bit more by being more aggressive with load shifting but I’m not going to massively inconvenience myself just to save the remaining marginal cost. I also now get the advantage of always coming home to a cool house on hot days as I set the air conditioner to come on during the middle of the day rather than coming home to a hot house in the afternoon and turning it on. Exported electricity is only worth $0.08 per kWh and bought electricity is around $0.32 per kWh so I can run the air conditioner for four hours off solar before it costs me the same as it would running it for one hour on grid power.

Great points to consider when looking at Solar you brought up many things that I would not have thought of previously. I wonder what effect the shade from the adjoining trees make to your system and if you have made any effort to trim them down a bit to improve your power generation

In Australia in 2021 we installed a 15kW system replacing an old outdated setup. The total cost was $10,000 AUD installed. We went for 3 separate 5kW inverters as we already had a Tesla Powerwall installation and we wanted the powerwall connected phase to maintain both battery charging from solar if the grid is down and emergency power to the house on most circuits. We are on a 3 phase connection. Australia is stupidly cheap for solar. My advice to people who ask is when you decide to buy, get the most you can afford, can physically fit, or are allowed to install at that time.

It's not a scam. It's a long term investment with so many risks. In the Netherlands, now we have to pay a monthly fee to return electricity to the grid. While energy companies and installers give you quotes based on certain assumptions, so many things can change between now and the break-even point.

Here in Germany, the "soft costs" are basically just labor. That accounts, on average, to be about 50% of the installation costs. We paid 17k for 12KW with a 10KW battery. Fortunately, we do have a "virtual" battery contract with the power company. Basically, rather than pay you a penny or two for upload, then charge 10 times that when you need the power back, they give you a one to one credit. This way, the summer production covers our usage costs for winter and fall.

When we were shopping I found the glossier the brochure the more the system cost. the bigger national companies will try to tell you there system is so much better because of XYZ but a watt is a watt, stay small and local and save as much as 50%.

Location location location indeed! Does the 17.2Wp/$55k setup Include the battery storage? Love your vids, amazed by how different the regulations can be around the world! Here in The Netherlands I’m allowed to do a whole install of solar incl. battery DIY without any permits.

I'm coming up for two years on my installation in New England. It was a big investment but also calculated to be a good one, certainly in the long term, and those calculation are proving to be accurate. Not only have we completely eliminated any electricity bill, we are currently making around $700 per year in energy production, in addition the SRECs we sell. I have zero regrets and am so glad we pulled the trigger when we did. Planning for retirement in around 10 years requires a number of investments and varied strategies, and having this kind of energy independence goes a long way to eliminating costs as our income is reduced. Many of the arguments I hear against solar are often fueled by misinformation and lack of understanding. Sadly, in some cases, the haters just want to hate.

These are all fair arguments. Another example: Several years ago now, I paid for the installation of a 15 kW net-0 system on a house I rented in Sri Lanka. Why? The system there cost about $12,000 to install, but zeroed out my $300-400/month electricity bill. Simple math showed the payoff was only about 3 years. There were multiple winners. In the time that I was there, the amount I saved on the electricity bill would only just pay off the panels, but I could feel good that it was good for the environment, good for the country that otherwise needs to import a lot of fossil fuel energy, and supported local businesses. Since the electric utility by law had to pay for excess generated electricity, it was a great deal for my landlord, especially in periods when the house wasn't rented. So, the landlord was involved in getting the process moving and choosing the installation company. It seems a good argument that in Sri Lanka, every house should have solar. It would be a cheap form of energy, along with Sri Lanka's hydropower. It would reduce emissions and trade deficits for imported fossil fuels. However, initial cost is still a problem for the average household, and the grid still needs a lot of upgrading. With these payoff periods, the government could just pay to install panels on every house since it would save the entire economy a lot of money and probably help bring a lot of people out of poverty! The USA is certainly behind other parts of the world in the adoption of renewable energy. Low adoption rates and resistance to it are part of what is making it more expensive. Some resistance to solar is understandable. As pointed out by Matt, the payoff period in the northern latitudes of the USA (as with other northern latitudes) is much longer than it would be in sunny areas closer to the equator, like Australia and my example in Sri Lanka, particularly since energy/electricity is relatively cheap in the USA. The average home owner moves about every 10 years, so if only considering personal finances, the investment might not pay off. Of course, if every house shifted to solar so that every house you moved to also had solar, the personal savings for everyone and therefore across the entire economy would be considerable, but this is generally not a personal finance consideration.

I am 100% going fully off grid with our new house. Massively overspecified panel grid, and battery bank. Supplemented with micro pumped hydro and small scale wind and a diesel genset for those bad periods that are inevitable. Why? Energy independence and reliability. No blackouts. No bills. No BS.

My van has a DIY install that in full sun can get 4KW off of 800w of solar: Cost 1500$ parts (200AH, 2000w AC, 30A SCC, etc) I figured out that the system generates 1/20th of the electricity yours does. Multiply my system by 20 and you have your KW output: $30,000 cost. $1500 x 20 systems. (16,000w solar, 4,000AH LiFePo, 40,000w AC inverter, etc) did you pay more for your system install? These are the types of industry numbers we should be looking for when installing solar. More expensive components means uncertainty if solar companies fold and you can’t get replacements. Redundancy of quality, low cost components is the path to victory!

These types of videos are so important. It takes these narratives that are so often pushed and breaks them down and starts a conversation instead. Solar may not be worth it for a person, but that doesn't make it a scam.

I got panels installed by the company I bought them from. They include the cost of installation with the panels + inverter. I understand labor is expensive but for a 7kW solar installation like mine, it took around 3-4 hours for 2 people + me. I helped a bit but mostly I was watching. They needed a crane which costs a bit too. Thus, in total labor is say about 8 man hours. One advantage I had was when building the house, solar was thought about. I am not certain how much electrical guys charge in USA, here it is about 1.5x minimum wage. We have no government support except for no VAT on import. Application doesn't cost much, but it takes a long time. It took a month to get permit and after installation it took about 3 months before they started to count our grid contribution. In total I paid 7k$ish for 7kW solar + 5kW inverter (this is the legal limit). There is no law permitting battery installation yet. I will see how much that would cost once that law passes.

Great video. In my area I have noticed that value changes over time as well. People who hopped on the solar bandwagon years ago got great rebates and perks. Now it is much harder to get “a good deal”, in part because permitting and regulations are much stricter.

Nederland has 3 Million houses with Rooftop Solar. Average 15 Panels, 400Wp is 6000 kWh production every House. 3 million x 6000 kWh is 18 Billion kWh Solar Rooftop Power every year. 18 GW. Prices down for consumers to 21 cent. 5 cent production costs, 13 cent Energy Tax, and 3 cent vat. is 21 cent per kWh in Nederland. Solar is not a scam.👍

Bro, love the content and delivery( u r very watchable I think it’s ur sincerity to help ppl). Australian here, just signed up for two 13.2kwpv/10kw inverter systems grand total of $9,899. AU for the both systems. 60 x 440w N-type half cut panels with 25year like for like product warranty and 10 year warranty on the inverters. I currently have 5kwpv/5kw inverter in place which produced 22kw today middle of autumn/fall. Think it works out to AU$0.37c per watt including installation, mounting hardware, cabling/conduit, electrical isolators, meter board work + export control device and all the paperwork. I will admit the Government payed the company AU$8925.00. Yay Australia 🇦🇺

Short answer for most home owners in Australia: repayment time is typically 7 years or less. Better if you can heat your hot water with solar excess. Do it.

One thing I never hear anyone talk about with solar, is that there is a difference in panel type, wether they are best at converting direct or diffused light. There is quite at large difference in production, on a cloudy day, between a panel that is build to handle diffused light vs on a panel for direct light.

Thanks for trying to address some push back, Matt. I have mostly negative opinions on several renewables; but I watch most of your videos and enjoy them, and I hope lingering issues with renewables are addressed at some time in the future.

Matt, it shocked me to hear how much you are paying for solar installations in the US. I'm in South Africa and we just had a solar system installed (8 PV's, 8kW Sunsynk inverter and 5kWh dual battery, labour). Cost ZAR 128,000 = $7000. In South Africa we are plagued by aging infrastructure and loadshedding. The solar is a godsend for keeping the batteries topped off and to drive the household when there is no shedding, which saves on the electricity utility bill . Like you say, depends on your needs, but here we needs it.

I always love your well thought out videos and trying to stay on an even keel. Also, I just realized that your voice reminds me of Casey Kasem. You could always have a backup job as a radio personality 😂

I did a DIY with 2 Sol-Ark 15ks and DIY batteries. Never been happier. I will never be without electricity. I have A ROI of 9 years with a base cost of .15Kw. If you have a cost of .15kw or higher then you also can do it and save money. If you decided to give it to a company with zero research and say build me a system well you might get scammed. The biggest things is always educate yourself and see if it makes sense for you.

As an Australian I never realised how much more expensive solar would be abroad, usually everything is more expensive here. I'm in Melbourne and I got a 6.6kw solar system installed in early 2021, it was $8600 but my out of pocket costs after federal and state incentives was $3050. It could have been much cheaper too but I opted for a better inverter, cheapest quote I got was $1800 out of pocket. This is all in AUD of course so my $3050 AUD out of cost is equivalent to just shy of $2000 USD. At that price is was pretty much a no brainer, I was originally estimating 5 years to pay it off (which was also a conservative estimate at the time) based on my usage but because electricity prices have skyrocketed here since mid 2022, the period of time required to pay it off was greatly reduced. It took just over 2.5 years to break even so now I'm just enjoying cheaper electricity bills.

This video highlights one of my critical concerns before we add solar to our house under construction now.

A diffuser isn't going to allow 100% of the scattered light through. Some percentage is reflected or absorbed.

South Coast of the UK. Small roof, east /west facing so split system. 3.6kw system, no battery but iBoost water heating system. £5100 fitted in June 2017. I sell £250 of electricity a year to the grid. Saved my money from bills in 5 years 7 months. Would have been 7 years but the costs went up 2 years ago and slashed my return time. Would recommend every time. Fit and forget.

Even at double the cost of a solar install in Australia, Matt seems to be happy with his system. That doesn't make solar seem like a ripoff.

We purchased our solar system back in 2017. We had a tax liability on the horizon, so re decided to offsite that liability by purchasing a solar system. Total cost for our 7.7Kw solar system was $24K, minus $8k rebate which directly toward our tax liability, so our return on investment of $16k took 7.5 yrs as our average monthly utility bill at the time was $200/mo. Yes, it worked out for us. We still have to pay three months out of the year higher due to our brutal Arizona summer months. Our monthly basic connection bill is $20-25/mo. We converse energy as our excess electricity is credited toward our future usage.

As you noted in this video, the lease agreements (AKA the guy who knocks on your door telling you about all the rebates and everything available to you if you "Go solar today!") are absolute scams, and it gives solar panels overall, a bad rep. Most of them still charge you for electricity used, even after you've paid off the purchase price. Absolutely ridiculous.

Hats off to you for reading the comments and taking the time to respond to some of the themes. Really appreciate that. I think your vids are awesome and they really provide a lot of great information for people who are considering purchasing a product or service you are reviewing. With solar, with most alternative technologies, there are a lot of reasons people choose to become early adopters outside of simple finance. For me, I've considered solar because I like the idea of being self sufficient, I like the idea of being off-grid for at least some of the time, and I like the idea of clean energy. If the cost is close to what I'm paying now then I would consider it. Thanks Matt for the great content!

I'll add to the "Rich person's problem" comment. I built my array over time, I started with 5 panels, I'm up to 14 panels for a capacity of 6.9kWatt/hrs of panels over 2 years. I sourced from SanTan Solar. You don't have to be wealthy if you plan out your system and build it as you can afford to.

I look forward to your video next Spring analyzing a full year of data on your system. I have 7 years of data on my Tesla solar panels. I know what the difference is between summer and winter production. I will be interested to hear what your experience is. Your weather patterns are quite different in Mass than ours are on the Central Coast (CA). Most of our storms and clouds occur between October and April with few clouds the rest of the year. This impacts winter solar production. Our system's Winter production is roughly 30% of Summer production. I would expect your system to have a smaller Summer/Winter variation than we have.

I put solar up 13 years ago. It cost 35K up front, but at the time, I got 16K back in tax incentives. My system is about 30% what Matt's is (5.2) production wise, but I've been collecting energy for 13 years now and I've been getting renewable energy credits. I paid off the no interest loan about 10 years ago. It is actively making electricity for me and the only thing I do is monthly report of how many kWH the meter is at and uncover the panels from snow 2-3 times per year (if I want to...the panels usually melt it off within a day and they don't produce as much in the winter anyway...but every few bucks helps..and if I am home...why not? It has paid for itself and now that my daughter is in college, our electric bill here in PA in a 1800 sq foot home is 90/month instead of the 250/month (and the budget still trends down) it used to be when we first moved in In thirteen years, I have seen NO degradation of the efficiency.

A friend has had solar for 5 years now. Based solely on the cost of the equipment, (DY install) VS Grid, it will payout in 8 years. But his home insurance went up $1600, rural area, no permit or inspection fees.

Great video. We live in New York State where there so many solar companies. The problem is We don’t know who is legit or not and we feel like these contractors are just trying to scam people. Please let us know when the standardized system are in place. Maybe then companies will be more honest about solar. Thank you.

This video is one of the reasons I always feel smarter after watching one of your videos Matt. You do your research and provide hard facts. One of the few people out there spitting truth on the Internet.

I got 6.6kW solar installed (remember it's average 6.5 sunhours a day here in Australia) to grid for $3200 AUS. It cranks. I set my pool pump to start with home assistant when there is sun, and use all heavy appliances during excess solar production and boom. Job Done. Our power is $0.27/kwh atm, and feed in tariff is $0.07/kwh so you don't want to sell it, but use it here in Oz. Thanks for the video. Really good watch :)

I live in SW Ontario. Been off grid solar since 2017. Designed and installed myself. Run a shop and house, no issues, no bills. If you don’t know what you’re doing, then you’ll have to rely on those who do. That’s not an issue with technology, that’s an issue of trust.

I am a DIY installer. So my direct costs are just materials. But it takes time and effort. I don't care much about the simple monetary costs. Back in 1960, my physics teacher in high school explained the global warming issue, and warned the class that we would have to deal with the issue in our lifetimes. Well, my lifetime is not far off, and in the intervening years, the only option seemed to be using the grid and gasoline. Adding up all the family emissions in that time comes to about 1000 tons of CO2. That CO2 is for the most part, still out in the atmosphere and oceans, doing it's damage. Currently, Climeworks charges 50 cents per pound to suck that excess CO2 out of the air and turn it to stone underground. That is a 1 million dollar CO2 debt. And still the emissions continue, even with solar, EV's, heat pumps, due to the accumulation of rental property. I need to make all that property CO2 neutral, just to stop running up my debt to the world. And on top of that, spend a million bucks just to dispose of prior emissions. ..... I would say that people who say solar isn't worth it, are not considering the cost of the damage that is and will continue to occur in the future for tens of thousands of years. So for me, the cost of not going solar is the biggest factor.

Here in Thailand I purchased the main components myself and paid : PV US$.17/W Inversion US$135/kW Batteries US$135/kWh I paid a local installer to fit (minimum wage here is $10/day) There is no permitting or inspection. I use my BYD Seal bi-directional charging to add extra backup power to my solar system and power my house and 2 EVs off-grid (no utility connections) videos on my channel for the doubters

My solar installation wasn't a ripoff, but my utility is doing its darndest to make sure that people can't break even on a solar installation. When I signed a contract for my installation, we had a daily minimum charge of $0.023, and a per kWh rate of $0.1029 By the time my installation occurred 5 months later, the daily minimum was up to $0.39 and the per kWh was down to $0.1025 Elevan months and two weeks after installation, the daily minimum charge is now up to $0.59 and the per kWh rate is now down to $0.0923 So, they now pay less for the electricity I generate and send to the grid, but charge me nearly triple to have a grid connection. Even without using any additional electricity, this makes it harder to bank energy against the winter months when production is down, and increases the amount of time it will take to pay off the system. This most recent rate change on April 1 has stretched my break-even from 11 years to 16.

Mine has been worth it even though it’s wildly inefficient and I’ll never make the money back that I’ve put in. It wasn’t really about money for me; I don’t use much electricity. For me it was about being able to make hot food and light my house/power my mini-fridge/freezer/run small electronics if the power went out in the winter, and similar in the summer. It was also about my learning, growth, and enjoyment, as I enjoy testing gear and systems. I’ve made a ton of mistakes along the way and could’ve been more efficient, but I had a lot of fun and this system has been here for me so many times when I needed it. So happy I started this, can’t wait to see how my system evolves over time ❤

You glossed over one of the big values (to me, at least) of solar. It lets me lead an electrically profligate _lifestyle_ with a clear conscience. I don't go running around the house turning off lights. If I want to leave the refrigerator door open for a minute or two while I am fixing dinner, no big deal. We just added a third heat pump split AC/Heat unit to the house and use it without worrying about the cost. My 65 year old house is amazingly energy _inefficient_ and yet we live comfortably and it costs us nothing to use as much electricity to heat and cool it as we desire. We are grid-tied, but off-grid capable. Without solar, our electric bill would run us about $4,000 per year. Our total electric bill for 2023 came to $20.47. Our system including battery storage cost us $35,000 five years ago. Today it could be replicated (with twice the battery storage and 30% more power production) for less than half that amount. But... good things come to and end it looks like. Last month, for the first time in five years we actually had to *pay* for electricity over and above the $20.47 annual grid connection fee. It seems that adding that third heat pump AC unit put us over the top of our production capacity, and it cost us big time: instead of the usual 58 pesos (we are retired in Mexico) we had to pay an extortionate 81 pesos. The billing is bi-monthly, so that worked out to _11 pesos extra per month!_ That works out to 65 cents per month in US currency. Maybe we'll cut back a bit on the night-time garden lighting to compensate. FWIW, we are saving to buy a Tesla when the new "Model 2" or whatever it ends up being called becomes available. At that time we will increase the size of our system to cover the Tesla's usage, and get rid of that extra 11 pesos we're paying now.

We don't feel ripped off. Our power company as of this year no longer will pay us credit for credit for our overproduction; they have lowered what we will get for excess generation, but you know we still win on this. Eight months out of the year we generate what we need on our own, two months it is about half what it was, and the two coldest months we generate a lot less, but even then we are not paying as much. We were older (70s) when we had our system installed and we cannot swing a battery system, but even so we have reduced our power costs dramatically. We live where there are 4 distinct seasons. No matter....we feel solar is a win-win. Just do your research thoroughly when buying. Not all solar companies have your best interest at heart. We love generating our own power!

I really appreciate your videos. A neighbor recently asked me about my panels so I happen to have my numbers handy. I'm an outdoorsman but not an environmentalist, so I needed solar panels to work financially, but tie-goes-to-solar, if you know what I mean. I'm in upstate NY, and installed a 5.9kW system in June 2018. The cost was $16,400 before incentives. There was a $4,130 incentive right away, so I paid $12,270 out of pocket. I was eligible for $3,681 in federal income tax credits and $3,068 in state income tax credits. Because of my tax situation, it took until 2020 to use the state credits and until 2022 to use the federal credits. In nominal dollars my system "paid for itself" by December of 2018. Had I invested the $12,270 exactly how my retirement accounts are invested and used those investment to pay the extra income taxes and utility bills I'd have had without solar panels, I would still have about $2,400. It will probably be another two or three years before solar panels come out ahead of the investment alternative. I invest pretty conservatively, so someone who is 100% invested in the S&P500 probably would need even longer. I expect my system to keep producing for at least 10 more years, though (probably 15 or 20 years), so it's really inevitable that in the long run it turns out to have been better than investing.