and if it shifted like shit you would be the first to complain, i lost because.. i got dropped because...

“Don’t challenge my bottom line, otherwise I have to change my bottom line”, someone said. 😔

Maybe they should just make groupsets where you only have a rear derailler, and just have a single big ring at the front.

You are spot on right and now bike companies are coercing us to buy grossly overpriced e-shifters by not giving us a choice of purchasing comparable mechanical group sets and charging us several thousand dollars more to, as you correctly put it, solve a non-existent problem. In my experience most missed shifts are more often than not a result of lack of focus and timing, not mechanical issues and eshifters won’t save you from that. My method of sprinting is pretty much identical to yours and missed shifts has never been an issue. Nor have I ever been dropped due to a miss shift as with most modern mechanical shifters in proper working order and properly maintained missed shifts is a virtually non-existent problem.

@@fradd4045Which quite frankly has never happened to me in over thirty years of riding and racing.

Don't worry, the next Tiagra will be the old 105, so no problem.

@@MrDan92700 OK, yeah, I hear you. One thing is for sure, Tiagra will have some big "Group set of thepeople" shoes to fill.

It needs to be like half price or less

@@Knowbody42 That would be an improvement but even if the price were cut in half, I would still want everything on my bike to not require charging to function ! Aside from lights, although I have thought about getting a dynamo. Maybe the dynamo could be set up to charge the lights and group set. Even so, I'll stay with mechanical. So in the future, I guess it's Tiagra the new group set of the people, for me.

You would think they could just reliable the older durace groupset. Granted some would say just buy the old groupset, but I'm having a hard time finding it for sale anywhere, guess they don't make it anymore.

Yep, that'll do it for me. Ultegra on next bike (still running the first gen dura ace di2 though....just won't die!)

Glad it was helpful!

I think the derailleur firmware needs to know your cassette size so it can work optimally and Shimano wont let you set it to anything smaller than 11-34. Purely artificial software limitation. Not sure how well it would shift with a 11-30 cassette with the wrong setting though. Hopefully someone tries it out.

@@viljamip FML, firmware on derailleurs limiting what cassette sizes you can use. Another reason to stay mechanical

afaik, the firmware is basically only for fully synchronized shifting, so it can help you find the best gears if you don't want to think about what chainring to be on @@viljamip

I'd say spend more on wheels or pocket the change

Glad it was helpful!

Glad you enjoyed it!

Furthermore, there are additional buttons on top of the Ultegra shifters which are not on 105. So if you want to control your Wahoo or Garmin with the shifters, you need at least Ultegra.

I'm also running r7000 105 mechanical on a Allez Sprint and find it fantastic. I do however want to clean up the cables. So I'm researching on what the better upgrade would be in a year. SRAM red would be my go to if sale prices are available for the group set. I think Ultegra might be my 2nd option.

If you ride on the hoods, why is satellite shifters the deciding factor?

@@DaveCM he is talking about the buttons on top of the hoods, not the sprint or climb satellite shift buttons you can add on your handlebars

you don't need to make a comparison. SRAM rival is plastic junk

Hi, shimano 105 di2 working with Shimano Shimano Dura Ace Di2 Sw-r9150

I think it's possible.

Unfortunately you can’t

the complete groupset of 105 di2 has dropped drastically over the past year, you can get one now for like 950USD, really tempting.

Hey, hope you don't me asking, this stuff is a bit new to me: 50/34 is considered compact? doesn't that mean for climbing purposes you'd want 11/32 or higher?

@@andrehendrik 50/34 is compact. its enought for the average club rider. 53/39 is what the pros ride. 11/32 will give you more range, but 11/30 should give you everything you need on the rear. Back in the late 1980's we only had 11/23 🙂

Ride 12% gravel / paved roads and the gearing works. Not everyone lives in the flats.

laughs in 11-48.

Venturi had to go back earlier than expected sadly, but hoping it'll return so I can film a review on it

@@davidarthur hard to get where I live. Very interested

Aswell as way more overweight

Because Shimano has designed it that way, with the long cage rear mech designed for larger cassettes. I'm sure somebody will try it but that's the official line

@@Carftymk yip on my old 11 speed cassettes certainly DA and Ultegra are interchangeable, I'd be surprised if the 3 off 12 speed versions aren't interchangeable.

Mechanically it will work of course, but programming your synchro shift points will show the wrong ratios (very minor detail though). Also, your head unit may not show the true number of teeth, but I'm not sure. I have the older generation Ultegra di2 R8000 with an 11-32 cassette which works perfectly even though Shimano spec says 11-30 max. My Garmin shows the correct number of teeth in every gear too. So go figure.

Sounder awful TBH

Yes I agree. The thought goes through my mind when I see someone who is 15 + kg overweight and with the top of the range bike to save some weight

It is a minor thing but your right , I would want that myself for my Garmin 830 , I didn’t know that , thanks for the heads up 👍🏼

Good call. That would be my choice as well. Upgrade where it counts most. The new 105 cranks are around 710g give or take depending on length and ring choice, basically same as previous generation with an updated look. I personally wouldn't upgrade them. On my 7000 series 105 groupset I upgraded cassette to Ultegra and rotors to dura ace. Mostly for weight but 105 rotors just don't live up to the rest of the groupsets astethic imho. Good luck with the new build 👍

So this is the 12 speed cassette where the last cogs are utterly useless, because they would give you speeds lower than walking.

It's not so hard to differentiate the two buttons, I've ridden with Ultegra Di2 R8070 (third-gen Di2) before.

The Di2 has always been like that since its inception. They probably did it to keep from accidentally shifting while braking. I had to stop myself of my habit of riding with my fingers covering the shift levers when I went to electronic because I would accidentally shift at times just by hitting a pothole or bad bump.

@@DaveCM Yeah, that makes sense. With mechanical it's more of a definite action, a push of the lever, rather than a button press.

feels like artificial market segmentation. Shimano trying to protect ultregra and dura ace sales

@@mechy2k2000 my thoughts entirely

I think the problem might be that the software won’t recognise the smaller cassette. Artificial limitations, in other words

Working on some merch 👍

I so hope so... Nearly all the bikes in my house are 11speed Shimano, and I don't want to go Di2, but getting hold of shifters is already getting hard, and they don't last forever/don't cope with crashing/ham fisted spannering.

@@hectorkidds9840 you can replace 105 shifters with Sensah Pro Team. They're compatible and very good quality now.

@@belverticale I'll let others be the early adopters but thanks and I'll keep an eye on what's going on in this space.

I think that that depends on the frame/handlebars, mechanical shifting is good with external cable routing but with internally routed cable can be iffy

They should have called it "Ultegra Sport" or something. There is so little price difference between the two that it makes more sense to go with Ultegra if the budget allows, which just seems crazy.

@@davekashuba4730 iPad school of marketing. Oh but if you spend a little more you get this one!

1 year later it's more than possible to get a 105 Di2 bike for under 2999euro. I just built up a gravel bike with a carbon frame and wheels, along with shimano 105 Di2 for 3500cad/2383euro. Could probably knock another 500cad off that price if I went with some other more budget parts like saddle, handlebars, etc.

I run ultegra 11-30 cassette it works perfect

You're not the only one here, I'm mechanical-biased too. I've actually ridden with Ultegra Di2 R8070 before and can actually live without it.

It's called progress. If you want mechanical buy Tiagra.