Is the Ultra Efficient basically a rebranded Dubai lamp?

@@soundspark Hopefully BC will be doing a tear down shortly - I havent seem them yet myself, but it would appear that way. If so... these should be the *standard*, not the ultra.

£31 + £6 delivery for a 7.3W/100W ! That's a single bulb not a pack of 6! I will stick with my old Philips 13W/100W until they get cheaper and pay for an extra 5.7W of electricity.

@@soundspark yes sort of😊😊

CRI = 80. No thanks

Yea I love Bigclive

Haha yes!

Yes I wondered if Phillips was finally going to allow the rest of the world to purchase the magic bulb shown years ago by big Clive. Finally we can. :)

I instantly thought of Clive and the Dubai lamps when I noticed it was 8LEDs for 4W. Very nice

I've done the bigclive resistor snip to all my lamps.

This is an evolution of the Dubai lamp. You have hit the nail on the head with key to led life and cost.

@@efixx I've been experimenting with running cheaper LED filament style lamps at lower power. It gives you less light output, BUT more lumens per watt! They should also last much longer. I simply put a 330nF capacitor in series with the lamp. This does make the power factor slightly worse. But luckily we don't pay for power factor in residential environments. ukposts.info/have/v-deo/gnhnbK15j4Vmy2Q.html

The problem with ( everlasting ) lamps is , once sold the company ( eventually ? ) goes out of business .. The whole world relies on a [ PONSEY SYSTEM ] Look it up ! .. pyramid selling , known in the UK , BTW .... this applies to the theory of TOO many BABIES , resulting in World Overpopulation ! ... you heard it hear first ....... DAVE™ ...........

whatch his vid, Big Clive, I done the same, hacked the hell out of them :), and they worked, after I did it, :)

noting that the wasted energy coming out at heat is only "wasted" when you don't have the heating on anyway, so is basically not wasted for much of the year.

There was actually a cartel of bulb manufacturers that conspired to make bulbs not last as long as they could for many decades. While at the time people didn't believe the stories about it, history has shown that it actually happened and was well documented and proven. I'd expect manufacturers are still trying to pull similar tricks, hence Dubai requiring an explicit specification for their bulbs to try and stop it.

Like most things in engineering I suspect there’s a triangle of cost vs performance vs lifetime.

I sometimes hear that they didn't have this problem in the Soviet Union, it's said that refigirators from this period are of legendary good quality, they never break down. It's really a tough call, both seem to have downsides. But I guess, capitalism has the favor still, governments need to ensure free markets and competition. Don't give privileges to big companys, because thats what undermining capitalism and fair competition. Both the Soviet Union and our free western capitalist system share the same problem : Human corruption. I wonder if we ever get that in order, what if....

@@edwinbruckner4752 love your comment. I hope you like to discuss? _"governments need to ensure free markets and competition"_ .. problem is parliamentary / representative democracy elects (selfish) individuals into positions of power, with some having nothing better to do than to create or maintain rules (which govern the economic system) to benefit themselves or friends / relatives at the cost of the rest (disabling competition / destroying free markets (1)). Diving further into this problem we find that selfishness is natural for individual living beings, which tells us right away that there is a conflict of interest here. To solve those CoI's people recuse themselves from the process, but politics affects anyone, so anyone being in that position would need to recuse himself. But we need politics to create and enforce rules to create societies in the first place so that opportunists can be punished for asocial behavior.. catch-22. _"Don't give privileges to big companys, because thats what undermining capitalism and fair competition."_ Why just big companies? By protecting small companies you create big companies. And who decides the levels there? Those selfish individuals again? Wouldn't individuals be incentivized to move heaven and earth to skirt / break company size rules to benefit from (at the cost of the rest)? Your assumption seems to be that there is a benevolent entity there that punishes selfish / asocial behavior by opportunists (or groups thereof). But all there is is us selfish individuals to run the show and man those institutions.. conflicts of interests galore. The free market at its core is a transparent, cooperative and competitive process that works by creating a level playing field (all enjoy the same rights and plights) while no one is being treated preferentially (2). So there is no one there that holds a position that is higher than anyone else. By electing representatives we deviate from this principle. We privilege some of us to decide over the rules that govern us, creating -big companies- aeh.. powerful individuals who by their nature will abuse the system for their own benefit (not all and to the same degree, but over time the system will be eroded away, bit by bit). _"[all societal] system share the same problem : Human corruption. I wonder if we ever get that in order, what if"_ 👍👌💯 You're asking the right questions. So that's a start. Without being able to describe the problem we can't work it. Per my analysis corruption is natural and bound to 'survival of the fittest individual by any means available'. In wilderness this works perfectly fine. Societies are a step up of wilderness by enforcing 'private property' and 'personal freedom' so that work sharing / specialization is more effective than wilderness's generalists, so overall comfort raises much much higher. But for those rules to be guaranteed it needs a benevolent monopoly force that violently punishes individual rule breakers while this BMF is being manned by the same type of individual.. this is the core problem and we won't be able to solve it by trying to remove 'corrupt' humans from the gene-pool IMHO, so it's societies and how the BMF works WITH selfish individuals being part of the mix that we need to address. Our political system requiring selfless individuals to function is the problem. The Greeks came up with democracy - a transparent, cooperative and competitive framework to get to rules that govern a people. We call this pure or direct democracy these days.. might be worth looking into as there everybody got a seat a the table when it got to deciding on the rules of the polis - no one was special (but as systems aren't changed top-down it won't help to solve the problem practically, this needs a different take IMHO - maybe we get to this later if you want to discuss). PS: How do you like this label for our real existing societal systems? Monopolism - a societal ideology in which the rule enforcing framework benefits a few at the cost of the rest. 1) the 'free' in 'free market' stands for supply and demand being free to adjust to each other (competition), not for markets free from rules. Markets per definition are the result of rules being enforced and this requires a benevolent monopoly force so that might doesn't make right and specialization is a valid (and superior) survival strategy for the individual. It's obvious that by influencing the rules of the market the even more superior survival strategy is to occupy those positions in society, but that turns the markets into an unfree one, one where supply and demand are not free to adjust to each other anymore.. by enforcing anti competitive rules that protect a few privileged companies. 2) That's only half the truth however as some privileging rules that are being enforced also can originate unintentionally, ala the road to hell is paved with good intentions. But ascribing the malice to individual selfishness for understanding the mechanic is less complex than consider 'accidents' right away (and there are some, one I know is at the core of our societies and causes a lot of problems).

@@edwinbruckner4752 my parents had a fridge(very very small compared to nowadays) and passed down to me, lt never broke down. Eventually I had to get rid of it as because of its size. It was a silent fridge, didn't have a motor! They won't make those anymore.

I have been writing the install date on the cap to monitor real life because of premature failure.

In my experience, it's not unusual for LED units to fail after about 2 years, and some types of small incandescent bulb will regularly die after about half a year. The situation is ridiculous.

i dont think ive ever replaced a burnt out led bulb other than when i drop them or damage them

Perhaps Phillips is different, but my general experience with LED bulbs is they don't even last as long as incandescent, and you never even come close to recouping the cost difference in energy savings. What a scam. The one place they make sense, is overhead flood lights. Incandescent bulbs have a nasty habit of the glass just dropping out, or breaking when you try to unscrew it to replace it. That's a tremendous pain for an overhead flood and can be dangerous too. ...better to pay the extra cost just to prevent that.

@@eventhisidistaken its possible also worth note is im from the uk and we run 240v ac system at 50 hz which maybe changes some stuff as mentioned by others perhaps try writing the dates on the bases perhaps they are lasting longer and you just dont notice i know i thought replacing bulbs was expensive till i realised i wasnt replacing leds every few months but actually replacing my energy saver cfl bulbs with led every few months till sudenly it stopped when i had no cfls left to replace however it does now occour to me your using phillips bulbs and i assume its the hue smart bulbs so i imagine there always "on" even if there not outputting light so the transformers capacitors and even the wireless circuitry is still energized even if your not using them im mainly using dumb led bulbswhich get fully powered off by the light switch when not in use

BTW, >95cri lamps often have significantly lower lm/w due to using violet LEDs and blue hues being created by luminophore. It degrades efficiency due to blue light also being made via conversion and violet LEDs being less efficient, but AFAIK luminophores have much wider band and that allows for near 100cri. Also "warmer" bulbs (lower K value) usually have lower lm/w Kinda sad that has to be a tradeoff

Good comment . CRI is not perfect though. It is defined over R1 to r8 usually (Ra value). There is also Re which is Ra extended which covers R1 up to R15. R represents deep red for example . A high CRI lamp often does not even extend to R9 unfortunately. There is no better light than sunlight. The future is sunlight concent... High CRI lamps are crazy expensivee because they are used for high paying niche areas like medicine and cinematography and improving sales of products. Deep red is important for increasing sales of strawberries for example.

I use incandecent bulbs they have 100, 99 cri i think

@@thepurdychannel8866 but the colour temperature is too low of those, like 2000 K . The sun's surface temperature is 5778 K, and daylight may be even higher depending on the atmosphere.

@@undefinednull5749 i dont have a problem with it they just look warm white not like the golden colour of a hps lamp

It was my possibly incorrect understanding that the "A" is descriptive of or names the socket it fits.

A60 is the metric equivalent of an A19 bulb. You are correct in that it is a measurement of the bulb's maximum diameter, in this case 60mm. The 'A' denotes the bulb shape (the A-series), which happens to be the classic old-fashioned shape we all think of as a bulb =💡. A60 therefore is a classic shaped bulb, 60mm wide. It has nothing to do with the wattage or wattage equivalent.

@@uncrunch398 It's not the socket but the bulb shape. The A-series looks like the type of light bulb a child would draw. 💡

Yes if it is in a stairwell where you need scaffolding to change it put the best lamp you can get in there.

With the lamp the extra cost in manufacturing is very small to use more LED modules and better quality parts. The biggest markups in the value chain from the assembler of the lamp to the outlet selling them are the last 2 steps, the retailer and the wholesaler. The production and shipping often are less than a third of the price, the rest is your local markups on the units, and your local taxes and duties. By me that is around 30% of the price, while the price at shipping point where they are made is very much lower than the retail price. The Dubai lamps cost perhaps a third more to make, as you get better volume discounts, and spend a little more for top tier parts, rather than the cheapest ones on market that morning. Might be an extra cent or two per unit in the volumes they are made.

My wife would want a new design light fitting long before the savings become a reality, so get the cheapest,it will be binned long before its life time, in my house, mileage may vary.

I agree, at £9.33 + VAT (£11.20), for the 3000K version, it's questionable whether it would pay for itself in energy savings. Until fairly recently, we still had regular incandescent candle lamps in a light fitting that took 6 bulbs. So, any LED bulb is a saving... with the LED Crompton bulbs we have now, that's 5W×6=30W per fitting, instead of 60W×6=360W per fitting. Also, another key factor is whether you need to replace you dimmers when switching to LED lamps.

Then, as others have mentioned, you need to factor the angle on GU10 replacements, I always look for 120° or more and prefer warm white, either 3000K, or better still, 2700K.

It’s a work of art!

Yes great to see that lovely neat MICC. It doesn't seem to be used for new work in churches these days either.

A lot of work making off Pyrotenax and Meggaring it.

I suspect the ultra efficient ones will come down in price when there are other brands that an offer cheaper alternatives

​@@waqasahmed939I don't think that's likely to happen, at least for the time being. I've not seen any other manufacturer offer the same options.

Filament also have multi chip leds on it, 210lm/W is pretty damn good when the driver is already included.

The filaments are super efficient

Linear COBs (chip on board) are more efficient than multi-chip SMDs (surface mounted LEDs). This is because COBs allow less spacing between LEDs, thus less packaging, they can be placed closer together, reducing resistance and reducing power usage, and also result in higher light output. If you mean MCOBs then those are the same tech as COBs but just multiple COBs... DIP LEDs are the first tech of LED and those are even worse... so not sure what you're talking about here... If you doubt this you can just search online for "Differences Between LED Technologies: DIP vs. SMD vs. COB vs. MCOB" there's plenty of results to show that COBs are the most efficient tech currently.

@@NotoriousPyro No, smd is more efficient than cob. Look at the leds with highest efficiency, those are mid power smd leds like samsung lm301

@@PM-wt3ye Whilst you guys are arguing about SMD (Surface Mount Diode) versus COB (Chip on board). I should tell you both that the filament LED lamps above use COG (Chip on Glass) technology. Comparisons between SMD and COB are a bit moot really as they have different uses and advantages - it's a bit like asking "Which is better - a Car or a Truck?" It depends if you are moving people or cargo. To be honest, I think that mounting the chips on a transparent substrate is key to the high efficiencies. LED's lose some light because it is emitted down into the substrate, making the substrate transparent allows some of that light to escape (=useful). Reducing the power per chip will increase the efficiency further, but there is a tradeoff as the bulb becomes more complex. P.S. the biggest problem with DIP is the relatively poor thermal management of the larger plastic package. Whilst the LED generates some heat, the junction temperature must be kept below about 120 degrees C. DIP packages were not capable of sinking more than about 50mW of thermal power (aka heat). Whilst some novel designs were tried, the advantage of SMD packages was the ability to mount the devices closer to the circuit board for more efficient transfer of heat. COB improved this further by placing the chips directly on the board. Filament LED's work differently, by using much lower currents to drive the LEDs, they improve efficiency and this means less heat is produced. Thus no heat sink is required.

Is it actually the same Dubai lamp? Or a half way house. The 60W phillips above is 4W and appears to have 8 'filaments' ? The dubai lamp with 8 'filaments' is rated at 2W. So although they have improved it over the others, I could be wrong but it doesn't appear to be a full blown Dubai type?

@@paintologin Oh very interesting question, I've had a look back at Big Clive's video and he states that each filament is typically rated for 1W. In this new mster range they appear to be running them at 0.5W and are getting 210lm/W from them. In the Dubai lamps in Clive's video the 2W lamp (Shown as "40W equivalent") produces 400lm and also has 8 filaments which is in the same ballpark as this new version in terms of efficiency, but is only running each filament at 0.25W. Their "60W equivalent" lamp has 12 filaments, consumes 3W and produces 600lm. It's very interesting that they are running each filament twice as hard, but achieving the same efficiency which suggests that the filaments are not exactly the same - It's possible that they have twice as many individual LED chips within them. The efficiency suggests that they are being underrun at the same level and therefore will also benefit from the same improvement in lifespan. It's possible that they have not gone to the same expense in the driver for these, but it is often the LED chips themselves which fail first.

i need a 2700k 75w Equivalent dubai lamp in e14 long shape

@@paintologin I think they adapted it for a broader market. The Dubai lamps were created to specifications set out by the Dubai government, but I think for most people, they would not generate enough light. But even with the higher power and shorter lifespan, these Philips lamps are still incredible when it comes to powerconsumption and lifetime.

@Steve D if you ignore lifetime of the Lamp yes.. the Dubai Lamps are massively under-driven to extend this as long as possible. Probably irrelevant for most, but this was also a requirement for designing the Dubai Lamps and shouldnt be ignored in a direct comparision.

yes, in Buenos Aires, electricity subsidies were so high that people basically got flat rate electricity. what happened? they just left AC on all day during the summer when they went to work so the house would be cool when they came back.

Nonsense, electricity production (I.e consumption) has been falling since 2005, it’s gone down by about 15-20%. Some of that is down to changing weather but most of it is from efficiency improvements and a lot of that is from lighting. I find it hard to imagine the environmental impact of manufacturing and shipping all those tungsten lamps about wasn’t more significant than an led lamp that lasts a decade. Think of how many electricians vans have driven to replace burnt out lamp holders - MR16 and GU10 nightmares. The only reason we’ve escaped rolling blackouts from our incompetent governments of the last 10 years is because consumption has been trending down - EVs might change that!

Indeed. From a global heating perspective, it's consumption that counts, not efficiency. If efficiency improvements lead to lower energy demand that's great, but efficiency is a means to an end, not the goal in itself.

Yes same, got Phillips 22W tornado lamps still around, and they are lasting well, even on as night lights outdoors, there they do around 4 years before failing, which is better than a lot of the LED versions are achieving.

@@SeanBZA i mean the problem with LEDs is the same we had with CFLs at the end of their era: chinese manufacturers making absolute garbage. we got one of those CFLs back in 96 or 97 too, but it was ridiculously expensive, around $25 back then. and it lasted well over 10 years (i actually replaced it because it was dim, not because it failed). the Philips HUE I bought for almost $50 6 years ago are still running strong - the $2 LEDs don't last more than 2 years... you get what you pay for.

@@83hjf Thing is when I bought the tornado by the box they were actually around the cheapest 20W plus CFL around, and I used a lot of them as well. I started using CFL units when they were expensive, and you had a plug in ballast and a separate lamp, so when the lamp went EOL you just replaced it. Still got a few of those around as well, though slowly running out of the PL lamps they use, so eventually they will either get the LED retrofits for PL lamps or will go with LED conversions.

@@SeanBZA the last "tornados" i bought were made by Panasonic and they're still working. they were slightly more expensive than no-name chinese ones. but they didn't sell them at the supermarket...

@@83hjf Yes Panasonic made great lamps, but the Phillips ones were the best, all the innovative technologies that they brought out in basically inventing the CFL lamp. Nicest were the A60 replacement lamps, with the glass inner arc tube that constrained the arc, but still had part in the outer envelope, so they ran cool, but had a great life, though slow to run up to full brightness. They still have some plants making specialist lamps in the EU.

Yes, especially when you know just how hard it is to install that cable and get all those bends exactly even, and all the runs exactly straight. Pyrotenax is not exactly a cable that is easy to work with.

I agree if the philips are £20 and the lesser are £5 what are the philips saving you in a domestic setting, i would get 4× £5 bulbs job done and the cost won't be £80.👍😎🇬🇧

Great point. The manufacturers might still opportunistically be hoping that people will mistake it for an incandescent-power-equivalent rating, though. ;)

… 18W is not less than 12W. I mean, maybe it’s more efficient so it’s putting out *more* than 1.5 times as much light, but 18W is still more watts than 12.

@@JasperJanssen exactly, but that how much of the labelling works. Which makes it very confusing for people that don’t know what a Watt or Lumen is.

You kinda do have to move the goal posts though in this case,the system labelled basically everything as A+ just for being not as bad as an incandescent bulb... makes no sense because that's such a low bar now those things are practically outlawed at this point, it was basically impossible to make a light bulb that didn't get an A or a B lol

The good old days mate. Give me Pyro over Fire Tuff any day.

Like you I have had the same experience many times. Although cheaper lamps may fail sooner and cost more to run, they often work out more cost effective over the long term due to the initial high cost of premium brands.

Use fiet LEDs next time, I installed over a hundred in a huge warehouse and they have many thousands of hours in an un air conditioned space, and every one of them is still kicking, not one flicker. You can get them at Home Depot or Ace Hardware Stores.

@@aarongreenfield9038 Fiet?

@@zen4men feit, sry my autocorrect goofed.

@@aarongreenfield9038 I am still none the wiser! ...... Not bought a new bulb in decades.

Usually input capacitor failure, leaks onto the pcb blows little fuse/resister. The actual led still works on low voltage dc. To measure real power consumption, run them on dc as power factor upsets ac power.

Buy cheap and you can buy ten for the price of the best quality bulb. PS lamp refers to fluorescent tubes as in "re-lamping a super market".

Homes in the UK aren’t billed for reactive power. You make a great point about enclosed fixtures and this is worthy of a dedicated video.

@@efixx I thought the EU demanded high power factor in all bulbs starting even in the late compact fluorescent days?

​@@gregorymalchuk272 The requirements for PFC increase in line with power consumption on a sliding scale. From memory, once over 25 watts you need full PFC below this. This could have changed it's a while since I designed power supplies. I'll refresh my knowledge and report back.

We aren't billed for power factor in residences...but will be.

Is that a US English vs UK English thing regarding bulbs? Here in the UK you put a light bulb in your lamp (which is a term for a kind of light fitting).

The standards have change, the old A rated are all down to D and E

And the fluorescent and LED lamps do not seem to last as long. In my opinion the energy rating should incorporate the energy used in manufacture, average lifespan and disposal; I seriously doubt the energy savings are anything like what is claimed.

@@marquisdemoo1792 you get what you pay for. LEDs used to be expensive but for some reason people believe a LED lamp, with a PCB, a power supply, a housing and all should cost the same as a glass bulb with a tungsten filament. It doesn't.

@@83hjf Well I haven't done the maths because I don't have the data, but that is the point, if it costs 10x as much and lasts 10% of the time it is 100 x more expensive. Now that is fine if over the lifetime of the filament bulb the electricity it saves costs more than the difference but somehow, I doubt it (well maybe now that energy costs are through the roof). Furthermore, what are the comparative energy costs to manufacture the two items. Finally, what are the environmental implications, bearing in mind glass is not in short supply.

@@marquisdemoo1792 my point is: a LED bulb is supposed to be rated for 50K hours, and a filament bulb, for 1K hours. if the LED costs 10x as much as the filamente, but lasts 50X longer...well. but the problem is that they now make leds that cost and last the same as a filament bulb used to. they draw less power but probably require more energy to manufacture in the first place... so we're back to the start.

The heat output of *all* devices inside any house contributes to the heating of said house. Anyone claiming otherwise has found a way to break the laws of thermodynamics. If you can do that you can make a perpetual motion machine and there would be no energy crisis.

One of the big DC wiring systems is good-old CAT-5 wiring using the equivalent of power over Ethernet, but without negotiating voltage and current. I'm not sure what the state of your electricity standards are, but it's well accepted in US standards. It uses a lot less copper for wiring, but has more wires back to the power supply. One of the big advantages in the US is that the lighting load is fixed, so a 60W load doesn't need to be assumed for a luminere. It's bigger in commercial lighting than residential.

The Philips lights actually boost efficiency by running them well below their rated current.

Exactly. Unfortunately it's not easy to find affordable LEDs with a CRI of 90+, let alone 95+.

I think the EU has high power factor mandates for light bulbs, and possibly has since the compact fluorescent days. Commercial costumers ordering in bulk from lighting supply warehouses always had access to high power factor bulbs due to power factor pricing for commercial customers.

Power factor for Philips LED lamps is 0.99!

@@towerdave4836 That's good, because most modern LED lights are 0.5 or less.

Thanks

Watt Miser! Brilliant!

correct and this is the missing point in this shill!

What a bargain it only takes 15 years to get the money back of the more expensive one... I think the new standard was pushed by big brands to help justify the huge price.

@Scaggs I would agree but why do you as a consumer gain by buying a more expensive lamp that can't be paid for on the lifetime of the lamp? It is just a sticker saying you behave well on the university.

Currently in the UK at £0.32 per kwh over 1000 hours a normal 60w lightbulb costs £19.20 to run as opposed to the £1.28 for the Philips one.... does this change your minds?

@@boingzebadee5337 the comparison is 3£ led light that costs 2£ to run vs the philips that costs 10£.

Yep as well as the improved safety logos. Thank you fakers.

an argentinian youtuber tested lamps and proved a lot of the "10W lamps" use only 6W. he got a LOT of hate comment from chinese lover latin americans saying "WELL, IT'S EVEN BETTER BECAUSE IT USES LESS POWER THAN ADVERTISED!" ...even simple things are difficult to understand for most people.

Buy your lamps and bulbs from a reputable store, I wouldn’t buy anything like this from Amazon. However if it’s not a safety issue like say 2” screws go ahead and use em. Amazon =buy be aware, very aware.

Ya my work shop i rebuikt the t12s that were in it. New ballasts bulbs etc.. I did buy led 8 ft fixtires but i dont like them they interfear with radio and i noticed in general inferfears with radio. Led is also too sensisitive to powergrid ripples. Lights in my house flicker fast slightly every few minutes with led and i hate it

The 'current environment' just makes the pay back period shorter. I don't disagree that many will as you suggest, but that doesn't make it any less short sighted.

And they'll need to buy three £2 bulbs in the same time span that one more efficient £6 bulb lasts, so what's the conclusion?

Like washing machines where the reduced cold feed only means that the cycle is long. I much preferred my machine with a hot feed that could do very short cycles. I am dreading the time when I have to replace my 2015 machine. My son who inherited my 2004 machine with dual feed had the computer board recently fail. His partner is a computer board expert so is planning to work an making it go again but they have bought a modern slow cycle machine until it is fixed.

I have one of the 3000K bulbs (not the 4000K shown here) and yes, there is a slight green tint to the light. It has a cream colour to it rather than yellow. The reason is that the phosphor has been chosen for its efficiency rather than its warmth. I picked my bulb because it was going in an outdoor porch to provide a light for the overnight milkman. As long as he can see safely, he isn't going to critique my bulb colour. In any long-duration safety situation, the efficiency feels more important than the decor.

With LEDs, lifetime usually goes up along with the efficiency. This is because the new A rated LEDs are driven with less current which boosts both efficiency and reduces heat, which leads to a longer lifetime. It used to be the other way round with incandescent lamps, where you could either have an efficient lamp or one that lasts a long time.

@@andreasu.3546 indeed this is a given for the technology but the ones that I have had fail have a supposed life of 25000h and a 3 year warranty, which to be fair the supplier honoured and replaced - but the same happened again in a similar manner so I gave up - I guess that's what manufacturers want you to do - at the end of the day if you need a new bulb you need one, most won't bother with the faff of getting a replacement under warranty and hence they can get away with dubious claims without much fallout - CFLs were the same - I was bitten a few times splashing out on more expensive ones with longer life claims and then finding they either failed or lost significant output over time :/

The problem is that LED's are not far from theoretical maximum efficiency, and any future gains are going to be minimal. For reference, a 100W tungsten filament bulb can be replaced with a ~12W LED today. At theoretical maximum efficiency that would be around 8W, which is a tiny ~4W gain over the ~88W gain of current LEDs compared to a tungsten filament bulb. We are also not considering the inefficiency all ends up as heat and well, lights tend to be on when it's dark, which here in the UK is generally in winter when we have the heating on anyway. This further reduces the inefficiency of a light bulb of any description.

4000K is classed as ‘cool’ light output

See if you only had saved all the quality Street wrapping off the strawberry cremes you could have added them as red gel and tuned the light to perfection.....

@@lezbriddon Sadly, for you, Quality Street has now replaced its foil and coloured cellophane wrapping with coloured, waxed, recyclable paper wrappings this year.

@@tikaanipippin this had better be an ugly rumour lol what will the proper of the blue Peter generation do, I cried for weeks when metal clothes hangers all turned to plastic

@@lezbriddon It was on Radio 4 today, but it might have been BBC fake information. There's a lot of it about. I always thought cellophane was compostable anyway, since it is a cellulose derivative, and wettable. I am sorry you mentioned clothes hangers, since I have a phobia towards them, equivalent to unexpectedly touching something cold and slimy.

At the time of filming the Philips lamp wasn’t available to buy. Comparing “filament” style lamps on a well known platform I worked out that you’d recap the price difference in 2.5 years based on 1000hr usage. I’ll look to add a TCO in the description

Fantastic. Thanks for the update

The fact you guys actually read AND reply to your comments, is what makes you quality UKpostsrs.

I got a Quite a few budget led lamps like 3€ ones and all lasted more than 3 years.

Because the maths is too difficult for some people.... You just know this is close to the truth.

That would need an electricity price that stayed at one price forever, where in reality it is one price today and another price tomorrow, one rate for someone and a different rate for a different supplier. unless you know the price of electricity for the next 5 years (for every deal the supplier's might charge) the cost they'd be giving would just be garbage and just speculative.

@@mrfoameruk No. Present day prices would suffice because it compares like for like. Therefore, the costs for energy would reflect any changes in all the samples. The purchase price is relevant. If a Philips ultra costs 3-4 times more than a cheaper lamp but only lasts twice as long, the cheaper option could still be a better bet cost-wise even if less energy efficient.

@@stevesales4263 but if electricity came down to a very low price the Phillips bulb may be a worse buy even if it did last longer. IT all depends on the price of electricity. Them saying the life cost for each bulb now when we don't know the price of electricity in 6 months will just skew the figure and which could be misleading 6 months from now.

I totally agree, it was mentioned 10's of pence to a pound or so difference, but thats not really true is it. Try £10-13 for the phillips and £3-4 for a cheapo actually WHITE light. No we know why there was NO real mention of the purchase price.

Not quite that simple - watch BigClive’s video on the Dubai lamp and why it achieves the higher efficiencies with more LEDs…

Which you have already apparently done based on a further comment further down 🤷‍♂️

Prices have tumbled tbf

We are moving to Serbia 🇷🇸 😀

1600 kWh per month, who needs that much energy in a home?

@@andreasu.3546 People who use heat pumps for space heating and water heating.

@Steve D Or if you take A LOT of hot showers ;-)

In December we used 864kWh of electricity and 1406kWh of gas (detached house, four occupants). If we had to use electricity instead of gas we might exceed 1600kWh/month. Including the standing charge (fixed amount per day) our electricity works out at about €0.42 per kWh. That's after applying the UK Government's price capping and VAT, but not taking into account the Energy Bills Support Scheme discount of £67 per month per household.