The Myth and Reality of Joseph Stalin’s Order No. 227 “Not a Step Back!”

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TIKhistory

TIKhistory

День тому

Joseph Stalin's Order 227 has led people to assume that the Red Army could only fight through intimidation. The film Enemy at the Gates is a typical example of this idea; showing the Soviets at the battle of Stalingrad to waste the lives of their men. But is this really the case? Well... no.
Yes, I said 1942 was the beginning of the war - I'm sorry about that. I keep talking about Stalingrad, and therefore I keep repeating 1942, 1942, 1942 to the point that it's become a habit. I then also didn't catch it in editing. So please forgive me for this error. The war began on the 22nd of June 1941.
Check out the pinned comment below for more information, notes, links, and sources.
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This video is discussing events or concepts that are academic, educational and historical in nature. This video is for informational purposes and was created so we may better understand the past and learn from the mistakes others have made.

КОМЕНТАРІ: 6 100
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
*EXTRA NOTES LINKS and SOURCES* The point of this video is to strike a more balanced view of the events. Considering that the balance has been mostly pro-German and anti-Soviet, presenting a more neutral case can make it seem that I’m favouring the Soviets over the Germans. Yes, this isn’t 100% unbiased since our perception history is based on sources and no source is truly unbiased, plus I am human and thus make mistakes, but it’s certainly not pro-Soviet. If you think it is based on the first couple minutes, wait until the end. And if you didn’t, and posted a comment complaining about my bias, shame on you for not watching the full video ;) Imagine a gauge (like a speedometer in a car), if the arrow has been pointing to the right mostly (favouring the Germans), then if we move the arrow to the centre we’re also moving more to the left, which people assume is favouring the Soviets. But in actuality, we’re striking a balance between the two sides. We’re being neutral. It’s just, because we’re so used to the arrow pointing to the right, any move left is interpreted as bad. But it’s not. We have to try and reach that midpoint, and keep the arrow there. If not, we’ve not got a balanced view of the events. The book “Stalingrad: How the Red Army Triumphed” was used for a lot of the quotes throughout this video. I highly recommend it! And the population statistics came from the book Harrison, M. “The Economics of World War II: Six great powers in international comparison.” Cambridge University Press, Kindle Edition, 2000. Please consider supporting me on Patreon and make these videos as good as they can be. I’m highly reliant on your support, which is why I’m going to say another big thank you to my current Patreons. THANK YOU! Got another Patreon update coming tomorrow, a poll, and a few posts too, so look forward to that ;) link to my Patreon www.patreon.com/TIKhistory Also, it was great to see some of you at TankFest yesterday! Just got home in time to publish this :) *Links* All my History videos in one playlist - ukposts.info/slow/PLNSNgGzaledhMtb3bsJkJmtECxS_mm_QM Your Perception of the Eastern Front is WRONG ukposts.info/have/v-deo/el2LfH5ubmaIrac.html The Numbers Say it All | The Myth of German Superiority on the WW2 Eastern Front ukposts.info/have/v-deo/l2dzeW56qoNqxac.html Why Germany Lost WW2 - OIL video ukposts.info/have/v-deo/o4agaX9nr4SDyZs.html Fall Blau ukposts.info/have/v-deo/oKqjapp7b5ynt40.html *Sources/Bibliography* Beevor, A. “Stalingrad.” Penguin Books, 1999. Chuikov, V. “The Beginning of the Road.” Panther Edition, 1970. Fritz, S. “Ostkrieg: Hitler’s War of Extermination in the East.” University Press of Kentucky. 2011. Glantz, D. “Colossus Reborn.” University of Kansas, 2005. Glantz, D. House, J. “The Stalingrad Trilogy, Volume 1. To the Gates of Stalingrad. Soviet-German Combat Operations, April-August 1942.” University Press of Kansas, 2009. Glantz, D. “Zhukov’s Greatest Defeat: The Red Army’s Epid Disaster in Operation Mars, 1942.” University Press of Kansas, 1999. Harrison, M. “The Economics of World War II: Six great powers in international comparison.” Cambridge University Press, Kindle Edition, 2000. Hill, A. “The Red Army and the Second World War. (Armies of the Second World War.” Cambridge University Press, 2017. Jones, M. “Stalingrad: How the Red Army Triumphed.” Pen & Sword Military, 2016. Liedtke, G. “Enduring the Whirlwind: The German Army and the Russo-German War 1941-1943.” Helion & Company LTD, 2016. Matthews, R. “Stalingrad: The Battle that Shattered Hitler’s Dream of World Domination.” Arcturus Publishing Limited, 2014. Overy, R. “Russia’s War.” Penguin Books, 1999. Overy, R. “Why the Allies Won.” Pimlico, 2006. Shakespeare, C.” Stalingrad: Struggle in the East.” 2014. Zaitsev, V. “Notes of a Russian Sniper.” Frontline Books, 2017. Thanks for watching!
@eevee1023
@eevee1023 5 років тому
TIK one thing with that manpower comparesense that italy and germany had more manpower without the rest of the axis, yes but i kinda think that gave a wrong picture because you didn't mention the allied manpower, yes i understand that this is about the east front but still, ouatherwise great video :)
@oliversmith9200
@oliversmith9200 5 років тому
I covet comprehensive comprehensions. On objects otherwise often obfuscated by partisan political prejudices; particularly. Impeccable presentation!
@schnitzel2121
@schnitzel2121 5 років тому
its funny how you are afraid to look pro soviet))) i know that westerners are raised and teached to hate ussr, but dude, if youre not pro soviet in this theme, youre pro nazi. there can not be other options))) and ussr was not an evil empire - it was a great country, and all soviet people loved their motherland and even their government. soldiers attacked nazis with two most popular words - for motherland and for stalin. during war lots of soldiers joined communist party.
@gregp7379
@gregp7379 5 років тому
Your missing a couple of relevant points, and have left out some relevant points from Overy's book. 1. The order was kept "secret from the general public until 1988". 1. Stalin's use of penal battalions, were not some idea gained from the Germans, they had been used in WW1 tsarist Russia 2. Richard accurately points out that "demoralization and indiscipline grew in volume due to Soviet military incompetence". Also, you compare order 227 to other Western Allies own propaganda and the dirty dozen movie. Only ONE US solider was executed for desertion in ww2 , and in fact since the civil war.
@argo_1060
@argo_1060 5 років тому
I feel you missed the important points in this video. 158,000 troops were shot by the Soviets. you brushed this number aside by comparing war casualties and overall numbers of the Red Army. You shouldn't have, this is a huge tragedy and deserves to be seen as such. The Soviets executed the equivalent of an entire army. 158,000 men were killed by the by Soviet troops following order 227. This is an almost inconceivable number of men, these men had families who lost husbands ,sons , and fathers. Then there is the facts around the penal battalions, 427,000 men in penal battalions is the equivalent of an entire army group. These men were forced into the most dangerous and hopeless fights. You confirmed that at least one of the units cleared a minefield "manually". Is this the famous unit that was forced to run through a minefield at gunpoint to "clear it manually"? What you are describing are horrific Soviet atrocities inflicted on their own people. Also the Western Allies only executed one soldier for desertion. The British and Commonwealth did not execute anybody for cowardice or desertion, in fact it was illegal for the British Army to execute soldiers. Though the authors of books about the war may have exaggerated how bad it was , it's not any better to white wash terrible events that occurred.
@l0ck3nj0nny4
@l0ck3nj0nny4 5 років тому
Oh boy, the comment section is going to make Stalingrad look like a nice sunday picnic in the park
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Don't worry, I'm ready
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
For a low cost price of £1 doubled, then doubled again, 64 times! That's right, you can get all this for just £18,446,744,073,709,551,615
@francoandres3850
@francoandres3850 5 років тому
Wait, you're telling me Stalingrad wasn't a nice sunday picnic in the park? I've been lied to my whole life.
@francoandres3850
@francoandres3850 5 років тому
A lovely picnic by the Volga with German friends.
@3ddevelopment979
@3ddevelopment979 5 років тому
@@francoandres3850 yeah but probably weather was not perfect for this season- heavy shell's and bullit's rain.
@x-ray-oh3134
@x-ray-oh3134 5 років тому
What you say is definitely not true. I know, I was there, in the cinema where Enemy at the gates was shown.
@tru8637
@tru8637 5 років тому
Wp
@tommyangelo5970
@tommyangelo5970 5 років тому
@@tru8637 wp
@Kriegter
@Kriegter 5 років тому
Wow
@nottoday3817
@nottoday3817 4 роки тому
I am confused. You are talking about false allegations about history or about criticism enemy at the gates?
@zeroceiling
@zeroceiling 4 роки тому
Omega Alpha ...come on..he is being ironic...suggesting that we only believe that which we see recreated by Hollywood
@ricardoaymay7232
@ricardoaymay7232 4 роки тому
"Rush B" - Joseph Stalin
@huiba1
@huiba1 4 роки тому
Comrade
@andrescd9327
@andrescd9327 4 роки тому
@@huiba1 Rush 🅱️erlin
@TheHydra-qt5ug
@TheHydra-qt5ug 3 роки тому
And by B.... He meant Berlin
@squidontheside5496
@squidontheside5496 3 роки тому
NOT A STEP BACK INTO THE TUNNEL!
@spartan8705
@spartan8705 3 роки тому
ATTACK THE D POINT -Marshal Zhukov
@user-sr5ov2tx5y
@user-sr5ov2tx5y 3 роки тому
Enemy at the gate is historically equal with star wars.
@testaccount4191
@testaccount4191 2 роки тому
it was never pretending to be historically accurate
@testaccount4191
@testaccount4191 2 роки тому
@Черногорский истребитель Well the west generally is very ignorant of the sacrifices the Russians made to stop Germany. The biggest problem is if you look at most of the English documentaries they always talk about D-day and North Africa. Both important theaters but arguably unimportant in comparison with the Eastern front. Everyone expects Hollywood to take massive liberties with the truth, but not so much from the TV documentaries.
@jintarokensei3308
@jintarokensei3308 2 роки тому
If you ask the average westerner they won't see much of a difference between the Empire and modern day Russia. It's hilarious.
@shauntaylor479
@shauntaylor479 2 роки тому
You trying to say star wars ain't accurate???
@fishyc150
@fishyc150 2 роки тому
Or braveheart.
@frankperkin124
@frankperkin124 5 років тому
My favorite Stalin quote is that it took a brave man to be a coward in the Red Army.
@urka666
@urka666 4 роки тому
There are probably as many fake Stalin quotes as there are real ones.
@charlotteinfinito3581
@charlotteinfinito3581 4 роки тому
Urkaim Abraham Lincoln once said never believe everything you read on the internet And Einstein once said you know your famous once you see fake internet quotes next to your name online
@mannemarco333
@mannemarco333 4 роки тому
caleb infinito Remembering rearing that in the history books. Can’t believe the union won the civil war by just smacking the confederates with laptops.
@scotsbillhicks
@scotsbillhicks 4 роки тому
Churchill complimented Stalin that there were a great many heroes in the Red army. Stalin chuckled, (that must have been blood-chilling), and observed that you would have to be very brave not to be a hero in the Red army.
@Moorsho
@Moorsho 4 роки тому
Stalin was not a great orator,Leon Trotsky was the only Bolshevik you could listen to his speech.stalin’s speech all have one word “yoke”
@Burkutace27
@Burkutace27 4 роки тому
Fun fact; when I showed this to my father, his first reaction was 'This guy's being paid by the Russians.'
@xSintex
@xSintex 4 роки тому
Well, our fathers are still humans, and are allowed to be idiots on certain subjects. My sympathies.
@worldoftancraft
@worldoftancraft 4 роки тому
My apologies, but, it is seems to be your father been threatened well
@worldoftancraft
@worldoftancraft 4 роки тому
@koinóchristos • 32 years ago ugu-ugu. No. Only in counter-propoganda purposes
@ec_money
@ec_money 4 роки тому
Yeah probably
@ec_money
@ec_money 4 роки тому
koinóchristos • 32 years ago well yeah I would, especially if I’m taking my government back in the same direction
@interestingi6481
@interestingi6481 4 роки тому
Another interesting thing is about the infamous sentence "Death of a man is a tragedy, death of a million man is just statistics", Stalin never said that. It was actually from Erich Paul Remark, the author of Im Westen nichts Neues. What Stalin said was, " a death of a man is indeed a tragedy, but are the millions of casualties caused by his wrong orders just statistics?" when he signed the execution order of a red army commander.
@MetalMouse67
@MetalMouse67 3 роки тому
interesting I Erich Maria Remarque 😉
@haroldfiedler6549
@haroldfiedler6549 3 роки тому
PLEASE! Your post is such total bullshit. Stalin considered every soldier captured to be already dead. He neither wanted them back and when the survivors were returned to the USSR after the war, almost all of them were sent to the gulag or murdered outright. Captured Soviet officers were given show trials before they were murdered so I guess there is that.
@interestingi6481
@interestingi6481 3 роки тому
@@haroldfiedler6549 Another poor guy brainwashed by Cold War propaganda. The main purpose of Red army's anti-retreat group is to stop ordinary soldiers from running away, and tell them to return to their units, or send them to other units. But the ones that advocates others to run away would be executed. From August 1st to October 15th, 1942, there were 140775 soldiers that were stopped by the anti-retreat units, 3980 among them wrre arrested, 1189 executed, 2961 sent to punishment camps, and 131094 were sent back to the army again. Where did you learn your history? From movies or games?
@haroldfiedler6549
@haroldfiedler6549 3 роки тому
@@interestingi6481 Only a total fool would believe Soviet "statistics." The whole concept is a total contradiction in terms.
@interestingi6481
@interestingi6481 3 роки тому
@@haroldfiedler6549 I can't convince a person who believes Australia doesn't exist. Even if I actually take him to Australia, he would say that it is all fake and he is actually in New Zealand or Europe or something. You are the same sort of a person.
@crookbrother9465
@crookbrother9465 4 роки тому
My history teacher showed the enemy at the gates scene in class and presented it as fact. Feels bad man
@eggshen6716
@eggshen6716 4 роки тому
Lmfao what school did you go to
@crookbrother9465
@crookbrother9465 4 роки тому
dude i went to Martin Luther King jr. High School in riverside CA and that same teacher recently got arrested and fired for rape his name was mr.Hampton look him up they wrote news articles on him.
@eggshen6716
@eggshen6716 4 роки тому
@@crookbrother9465 sounds like the type of teacher to get convicted of rape
@crookbrother9465
@crookbrother9465 4 роки тому
@@eggshen6716 he was a really cool dude but thats what he gets for insulting mother russia
@Kriegter
@Kriegter 3 роки тому
oh damn that is cringy it's like showing the patriot and saying it is real oh wait, that happened to!
@princeofcupspoc9073
@princeofcupspoc9073 5 років тому
Next you'll be telling us that Churchill and Eisenhower didn't have angel halos and wings. How dare you.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
I've already said that about Churchill. Check out my first Battlestorm Crusader video
@aesop8694
@aesop8694 5 років тому
Princeofcups. Churchill was an ignorant, treacherous old bastard, who rewrote history to promote himself. This was even more evident when he lost his position at wars end.
@daviddebroux4708
@daviddebroux4708 5 років тому
@@TheImperatorKnight I have a feeling OP was being sarcastic, especially at the end.
@arthurmorgan8420
@arthurmorgan8420 5 років тому
TIK >:(
@arthurmorgan8420
@arthurmorgan8420 5 років тому
Aesop >:(
@richardnavarrete9010
@richardnavarrete9010 5 років тому
Stalin: execute order 227 Solider: yes my lord
@honpolyo
@honpolyo 5 років тому
*soldier fleeing*, *NKVD appears through the smoke with ppsh-41* "Hello there".
@aneesh2115
@aneesh2115 5 років тому
@@honpolyo general Zhukov
@comradeivan3903
@comradeivan3903 5 років тому
@@aneesh2115 he is a bold one
@duylai2224
@duylai2224 5 років тому
Stalingrad I the Russky menace
@ahmedshaharyarejaz9886
@ahmedshaharyarejaz9886 5 років тому
I was looking for this comment. Was not disappointed.
@Goannadria
@Goannadria 4 роки тому
I heard the phrase "time is blood" for the first time in this video, and I immediately figured it meant "do things quickly or it will cost lives". How can you hear "time is blood" and be like "hE doEsN'T vALuE ThE LivEs oF hiS mEN"? That's some Drax level of metaphoric ignorance.
@worldoftancraft
@worldoftancraft 4 роки тому
That level of ignorance - is level of modern moza Russia anti-communists. Of fighters with specter of past.
@leiloan7677
@leiloan7677 3 роки тому
"time is money" : if you waste time, you waste money "Time is blood" : if you waste time, you waste lives Congratulations, you accomplished a first grader logic test
@fotisargyrakis6803
@fotisargyrakis6803 3 роки тому
They think it means "to buy time you need to use blood"
@user-bn1zd3us5l
@user-bn1zd3us5l 3 роки тому
Just wanted to add a few things on the penal battaliaons: There were 2 types of penal units: penal battalions and penal companies, the difference was that the battalions had officers only and companies had low rank soldiers. It was not only for those who pannicked, but also for those with discipline violations such as drinking or brawling on duty. As for common criminals joining the ranks - only those who did minor crimes were allowed to fill a plea to be released to fight, murderers and rapists weren't able to join penal unit (unlike some German ones like Derlivanger's squad). Those with severe ordinary or political crimes were assigned only a hard labour far from civilization. Another point about penal battalions leading the way and about pride of serving: since penal battalions consisted of officers, they had mich wider tactical understanding of the situation, counciled desidion making, much more effective tactical cooperation and personal initiative in battle, then an ordinary battalion. It was almost impossible to stop the batallion by killing the co's or by separating the unit in battle. It was proven so effective that this experience influenced the organization of Soviet special forces by picking experienced officers on each combat role, then by training private recruits. Same evaluation can be seen in some German memouars, where German soldiers expressed dread about Russians beign able to send units souly consisting of officers against them. Also after certain period or for deeds, the ranks and medals were given back to the redeemed fighters, often even with assigning extra ones. As for cleaning minefields "manualy" - it's a normal Soviet/Russian practise to this day to assign ordinary (not necessarely penal) soldiers to clean simple minefields by their own, in case sappers cannot get on time or waiting causes bad sitations, even mandatory conscrits do this kind of training nowadays. Alsoo about Ehrenburg's statement: the way he depicted the attitude towrds Germans is very sadistic-narcissistic and very dissgusting, he's on the same shelf as the nazis were. Tven despite the obvious attitude towards faschist during the war, there was no revers nazism of such type by far, although faschist were considered "inhuman" rather then "nonhuman" and in the early years of war often were shot when surrendering after battle. There were instances when SS soldiers were drowned in a cesspool or captured soldiers burned alive inside barn as simetrical act of retaliation, but that all, they were treated more like a predator, like a wolf that wants to eat your children, but not like some neanderthals. German laguage, music and literature was still taught during and after the war, everyone could've boght officially produced books, painting copies and vinil records of German authors.
@Cripalani
@Cripalani 2 роки тому
Фамилия вносит долю иронии в концовку написанного :D жму руку за отличный комментарий
@brainy742
@brainy742 2 роки тому
Спасибо товарищ
@sErgEantaEgis12
@sErgEantaEgis12 Рік тому
Dirlewanger's Brigade was fucking brutal. The guy was a literal convicted child rapist and psychopath and his SS unit was where they send rapists, serial killers, pedophiles, etc... Many of them had serious mental health issues or drug and alcohol abuse. Their discipline was non-existent. The Nazi fully encouraged this because they were using them for terror and genocide - i.e they were sending them against unarmed civilians. When the SS Dirlewanger's Brigade went against actual Soviet soldiers they tended to get rekt. A significant number of casualties in the Dirlewanger's Brigade were from people driving drunk and crashing their cars and killing themselves, friendly fire accidents, overdoses, accidents, etc... Even regular Nazis hated them and wanted nothing to do with them. How much of a piece of shit are you when literal Nazis think you go too far?
@tomservo5007
@tomservo5007 5 років тому
Considering how Hollywood depicts 'hacking' and how computers work , I never get my knowledge from them. Instead, they spark an interest and I'm off to do more research.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
I don't make my videos to be definitive; I want my videos to act as the spark, to encourage you to do more research. Sources I used are in the pinned comment.
@manco828
@manco828 3 роки тому
Mr. Robot was the first TV/movie to more or less accurately depict what hacking looks like, even though things were still sped up and simplified. At least they should the use of terminals, but code should have been written in some IDE. They never showed that part.
@benismann
@benismann 3 роки тому
@GREGORY RENK they did lol. But stopped somewhere around the pre-winter-war borders. I guess they had an actual experience with the Soviets so they decided not to overextend themselves
@Flint404
@Flint404 5 років тому
Thank you for telling this. My grandfather is a veteran who fought in the Battle of Kursk, he was furious when he saw Enemy at the Gates. That movie is very hated in Russia.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
You're welcome :) all film producers should be banned from making historical films unless they intend to get it right. Making stuff up, like this film does, should not be allowed.
@Flint404
@Flint404 5 років тому
I like watching old propaganda flicks. One could argue that the US made more of them than the USSR. Good thing the Cold War is over and will never repeat itself... oh wait. :D
@chrisvalcu7228
@chrisvalcu7228 5 років тому
For a very good reason. It is also a piece of SHIT movie
@ansbremen
@ansbremen 5 років тому
uncletigger Please, name a Soviet movie, misrepresenting US war effort.
@ansbremen
@ansbremen 5 років тому
uncletigger I'm not playing a game, I'm asking a question. You said, the SU made "a HEAP of movies mis-representing or outright lying, about the role of the USA in WW2". I asked you to name ONE. So name it.
@minhvo8009
@minhvo8009 4 роки тому
Real History: "The Soviet were fighting just like any other decent army would considering they were unprepared and surprised by the German massive invasion. Though there were difficulties but with the resilience of the people defending their homeland and in several occasions, superior tactics and courage, they prevailed". Western History through movies/games/books: "The Soviet were dumb, they didn't make use of the fact that they had a long history of warfare so there were some extent of experiences but instead keep throwing men thoughtlessly into a meat grinder. But then winter came and the Germans decided to lose because why not, they're Germans, they could do whatever they want, including loosing a lot. But it was definitely not because the Soviet did it, either the Germans lost on their own accords or the Western Allies defeat them. The end."
@minhvo8009
@minhvo8009 4 роки тому
Dod o I see that you’re using the same thing you put on me too. The British and French at that time were even more unreliable than Germany under H**ler. They signed at least 10 treaties/agreements with Germany and basically gave her Austria for free. The Soviet Union tried to pull them to her side for years but they did nothing. It’s even funnier that the Molotov- Ribbentrop agreement was the only big agreement the Soviet made with Germany but that’s the only thing your kinds of historians speak about. While even Poland made an agreement with Germany and obviously France, England did so a dozen times but everybody seems to forget.
@andriserglis5535
@andriserglis5535 4 роки тому
Soviets had destroyed every occupied countries military command and for a lot of people it was not the motherland it was the promise of red army not staying in their homeland. Order 227 was also important so that occupied territory army would have motivation to keep on fighting. Stalin was a horrible person but the only thing he got right is that the only way to rule over ussr is by having enough vodka and killing anyone who did not flatter soviet union.
@VenomCold
@VenomCold 4 роки тому
fact is that germany blunderd by attacking stalingrad early instead of cutting off supplylines via a diffrent river crossing. its more about germany failing rather than russia succeeding
@minhvo8009
@minhvo8009 4 роки тому
VenomCold But you didn’t point out that after the defeat at Moscow, Germany needs an iconic victory because the war has been dragging long enough and no “real” success was achieved. The two biggest goals to stop the Soviet were presumably cripple their industrial power or capture Moscow. Germany failed to achieve neither of that for a whole year. It’s easier to blame H**ler for not pursuing strategical targets but keeps neglecting the morale of their troops and that of the people at home. Germany needs an iconic enough victory and that’s why they targeted Stalingrad.
@VenomCold
@VenomCold 4 роки тому
Minh Vo True it was a mistake nonetheless to attack it head on. Id imagine a similiar approach as the russians did to curt off the 6th army wouldve had much better chances of success
@pyatig
@pyatig 4 роки тому
Dude I can’t thank you enough for doing this. I was born in Odessa and currently live in NY. Both of my grandfathers fought in the war, one made it home one didn’t. Most of great uncles also fought, some even won medals. It’s so disappointing to me how the war on the eastern front is thought of in the West. Once again thank you for shining a light on the heroic sacrifice of the Soviet soldiers.
@lp9280
@lp9280 3 роки тому
Yeah propaganda in favour of you is always nicer to hear than against you.
@MrKakibuy
@MrKakibuy 3 роки тому
@@lp9280 Except its not propoganda.
@jakublulek3261
@jakublulek3261 2 роки тому
And for me it was propagated even more because my great-great-grandfather fought in Polish-Soviet war of 1920-1922 and my great-grandfather was in Polish legion of British Army in WWII. He hated Russians more than Germans (who killed his mother and both sisters in holocaust), he was persecuted by comunists and blamed Soviet Union for destruction of his country. "The only place where I can tolerate Russian is where barrel of my Lee-Enfield is pointing" he used to say (even when he was interrogated by secret police). And by "Russian" he meaned anybody from Soviet Union by the way. Many Polish patriots thought the same way, and my whole family was persecuted during communist era because of theyr Jewish ancestry and for being "politically unreliable". Not much love for Russia was around when I was growing up. Also, Soviet Union with it's propaganda and "police actions" just made people in Eastern Bloc sick and doubtful about everything. It is very difficult to decouple honest, heroic people of Soviet Union from horrific regime they are forever connected to. I always thought that for the West, who never lived through horrors of communism, it would be easier to see the other perspective than for us, who have that experience and resented bitterly anything Soviet, good or bad.
@shibre9543
@shibre9543 2 роки тому
Salute from France
@republic0_032
@republic0_032 2 роки тому
@@jakublulek3261 no wonder the Soviets had no love for you 😂
@shaneardinger2214
@shaneardinger2214 5 років тому
What's better than a informational video on youtube? a informational video on youtube with a full citation page!
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
It's a rare treat :)
@olefredrikskjegstad5972
@olefredrikskjegstad5972 5 років тому
"Peasant Soldiers charging across the open streets of Stalingrad, getting mowed down by the Germans, retreating back to their own lines before getting mowed down by the NKVD Blocking Detachment" The hell is this? Real life or Warhammer 40,000? _Imperial Commissar Voice:_ "RETREAT IS HERESY AGAINST THE GOD-EMPEROR" _BLAM-ing ensues_
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Exactly, it makes zero sense, even in 40k.
@potentialsus4851
@potentialsus4851 5 років тому
It makes perfect sense in 40k. Welcome to 40k.
@matty9699
@matty9699 5 років тому
Pyro Gear ehh we basically saw this shit in the Chechen War with Russian conscripts being sent to their deaths due to Generals not giving a single fuck about the men under their command
@QwertyBoredom122
@QwertyBoredom122 5 років тому
Fun fact: even in 40k this isn't real and is a myth, the guard still use what is essentially modern combined arms tactics (at least as close as possible considering how regiments work), the myth comes from the Imperium's almost limitless tolerance for casualties in order to win a war, there is a significant difference between sacrificing as many men needed and pointlessly throwing men at a position you know they cannot take, only penal legions have the misfortune of actually being used in such ways and even then its a fine line.
@Justanotherconsumer
@Justanotherconsumer 5 років тому
The logic is not that far off - letting the Xenos (or the Germans) advance will result in far greater catastrophe than a military defeat. Stalin was a cold hearted bastard, but from a military perspective and from a duty of the military to protect civilians, it made complete sense.
@anderskorsback4104
@anderskorsback4104 5 років тому
I can somehow get how Order 227 would have been viewed approvingly by many of the frontline troops. They knew they were fighting for survival, and that anyone doing an unauthorised retreat would just make it worse for everyone who stood and fought.
@VenomCold
@VenomCold 4 роки тому
2 soldiers sharing 1 gun yikes
@metalfire86able
@metalfire86able 3 роки тому
It scare them even more
@naoyanaraharjo4693
@naoyanaraharjo4693 3 роки тому
@@VenomCold one men get Mosin, two get PPSH!!
@ronaldbeck1762
@ronaldbeck1762 2 роки тому
The Soviets executed 158,000 troops for that " unauthorized retreat ".
@tophernolastname2378
@tophernolastname2378 Рік тому
War also brings out the worst in men, they become bloodthirsty & it helps them survive. This is when managing your troops comes into play, and engaging in things that exacerbate this bloodthirstiness-- like penalizing your own men, even killing them for a human response like running away to survive-- you make them behave more inhumanely. Exacerbating this inhumanity that bloodlust craves, will, of course, be met with approval by the troops. Preventing this type of mentality from ever manifesting, is where the values of an army is dictated. George Washington talked about this in "On Recruiting & Maintaining an Army". The genius of Stalin, was he had a way of phrasing everything to make it seem like "the only option"-- EVERYTHING Stalin did, "makes sense in a way", not because it is actually a good idea, but because Stalin's rationality is "it's this or nothing else". Which is also code for: "it's my way or nothing". Which sounds moderate... until you realize he's talking about something which will kill people needlessly. This is why Order no. 227 & Stalin's insanely-genius plan to have the civilians watch the Moscow military parade while the Germans were 10 miles outside Moscow, so the soldiers would be inspired to fight as hard as possible, were effective... but inefficient as far as fulfilling the goal of not-needlessly-wasting-your-own-population's-human-life.
@user-db8np1er4s
@user-db8np1er4s 4 роки тому
My grand grandfather were killed by German airstrike on their howitzer unit (not sure how it's called) which stayed across Volga river in Stalingrad. The other grand grand father died on a mine in the Kursk battle. My grandfather survived and he finished the war as a colonel. He was the most smart and kind person in the world. I live in Canada but I saw western and eastern people. Both sides have good and bad people. But nobody is compared to some of those heroic, bright and very polite Russian veterans. Now you know why I don't watch movies about heroes. Captain America and Spiderman are nothing to real heroes.
@sashacargoulo7089
@sashacargoulo7089 4 роки тому
Hollywood is propaganda fuck those films
@yourmomma8065
@yourmomma8065 4 роки тому
Commie shit
@TEXASRUSKI
@TEXASRUSKI 4 роки тому
MCRENER D are you talking shit about the the veterans?
@TEXASRUSKI
@TEXASRUSKI 4 роки тому
Kyle Reese which one there’s a lot of those.
@notasoviet1016
@notasoviet1016 4 роки тому
MCRENER D that can apply to both the Germans and the Russians
@theduke7539
@theduke7539 5 років тому
It actually stands today in the US, to retreat without the order is desertion, and desertion while in combat is a capital offense.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Really? How barbaric! (sarcasm)
@weirdwalrus5757
@weirdwalrus5757 5 років тому
TIK hahahaha
@renel8964
@renel8964 5 років тому
I shot the coward, but I did not shoot the deputy, ooo ooo ooo.
@poorminer3951
@poorminer3951 5 років тому
YES it is still on the books as such. But it will never happen. Anyone that does such an act will face UCMJ action and charged with murder. Also the one that runs will face UCMJ action, if no good reason is found. But it is very hard to prove not a good reason. It has been this way since the late 80s that I personally know of.
@poorminer3951
@poorminer3951 5 років тому
Also I found out when I was an NCO that even though it is on the books it will never happen. Here is why. Once this happens, the army will mutiny. Often times the one doing the shooting, keeping them going forward, is killed. So in reality it doesn't work. A "good idea on paper but useless in the real world "
@insertusername4716
@insertusername4716 5 років тому
I am RUSSIAN and US citizen. My father past that horrible war from 41-45. Remember his blood chilling story's. Thanks for been objective.
@Idontknowwhat2type
@Idontknowwhat2type 5 років тому
2016 memes it’s pretty tough for a lot of people. Especially since it can take about half a decade for some. With trump now there are issues with visas that arise. The us is constantly making it harder and harder for people to get in. Especially when there is only a fraction who are allowed in each year anyway.
@pirotess2
@pirotess2 5 років тому
@@PyroNexus22 Come to Vietnamese American communities in Bolsa city, 75% of Vietnamese American can't even speak English, but still US citizen.
@ethanbrock5453
@ethanbrock5453 5 років тому
@@PyroNexus22 Becoming a citizen has nothing to do with speaking good english, you just need to know enough to get by
@ethanbrock5453
@ethanbrock5453 5 років тому
@@PyroNexus22 Lol it's not at all impossible
@ethanbrock5453
@ethanbrock5453 5 років тому
@@PyroNexus22 I saw that you said majority, i was saying thats not true
@MarshallEubanks
@MarshallEubanks 4 роки тому
Don't think that most armies don't do this if they feel it is necessary. When I was in High School I had an older friend who was a US Marine in Vietnam. One day we were chatting about the War, and I asked him about the Tet offensive. He said that he manned a machine gun at a bridge over a river (I assume the Perfume River). I asked if he had to stop the North Vietnamese, and he said no, the ARVN (the South Vietnamese). I was pretty shocked (being more naive in those days) and said something about how he must be joking, but he said that the ARVN tended to run away (he used stronger terms) and that had to be stopped. He also said he used his gun in this cause, and that it was effective.
@nelsonsham2368
@nelsonsham2368 4 роки тому
US army has friendly fire in any war, Vietnam was pretty dark one thought
@VeryFamousActor
@VeryFamousActor 4 роки тому
@@nelsonsham2368 A bit more than friendly fire.
@hanselsihotang
@hanselsihotang 4 роки тому
@@nelsonsham2368 yeah, "friendly". You can't always differ which one that were a really unintentional friendly fire tho.
@arismaiden6457
@arismaiden6457 4 роки тому
No need to bring Vietnam as an example. The British Army had a similar reaction during the retreat to Dunkirk. British officers killed soldiers that disobeyed their orders
@theedankesst5631
@theedankesst5631 3 роки тому
@@VeryFamousActor Stop. You're a wannabe communist.
@sjnm4944
@sjnm4944 4 роки тому
This is the kind of content we come to UKposts for, and used to watch History Channel for. Great stuff.
@0wl_777
@0wl_777 5 років тому
Funny strory: My great grandfather (from mother's line) was soldier in Red Army since 1939 until 1945. He had fought in Berlin but after war NKVD put him in jail, they thought that he and other soldiers in his battalion helped some Germans to leave the Berlin. He spend 1 year in prison but than was justified. My other great grandfather (father's line) was in NKVD until it's end in 1946. I can just picture them together in prison cell, glaring at each other, wishing each other death and not knowing that in 50 years they are will family.
@blaxorheart8695
@blaxorheart8695 5 років тому
How the fuck do you have 2 great grand father?
@samovarmaker9673
@samovarmaker9673 5 років тому
+blaxor heart 1 on the mother's side, 1 on the father's side. That makes 2. What's so strange?
@thelux8539
@thelux8539 5 років тому
Everybody would have 4 great grandfathers lol. Look at a family tree
@gio2
@gio2 5 років тому
Same both of my great grandfathers were in the war both of em got caught but they were in different camps
@gio2
@gio2 5 років тому
@Tyrone Marsh how?
@dvchel
@dvchel 5 років тому
I remember reading that even the legendary sniper of Stalingrad, Vasily Zaitsev, said that Order 277 was welcomed by the majority of the troops. They were in *need* of this kind of discipline.
@corkcamden9878
@corkcamden9878 4 роки тому
You, sir, have invested much blood,sweat and tears into the mastery of your subject. You make good logical sense via honest scholarship. Your are a rare academic.
@scottcook7928
@scottcook7928 4 роки тому
yeah Brother, I agree! I just sub'd
@dnickaroo3574
@dnickaroo3574 5 років тому
During the Russian Civil War (1917 -- 1922) Chuikov served as a private soldier in forces commanded by Commissar Josef Stalin. Ironically, his first battle was for control of a small town on the Volga River named Tsaritsyn, which was later renamed Stalingrad. In 1942, the previous Commander of the 62nd Army despaired of their ability to hold Stalingrad. General Yeremenko approached Chuikov who told the Front Commander, "We do not dare lose the city!" He then assured Yeremenko that the 62nd Army would hold Stalingrad or die in the city. He laid plans for a street fight, pinpointing future strong-points where the enemy would be forced to pass on their march to the Volga. He designated these as "kill zones" where Germans would be concentrated in the greatest numbers -- they were targeted by artillery on the other side of the Volga River. Chuikov ingeniously hid artillery and tanks in the ruins, and used small squads of six to eight men, supplemented by sharpshooters, to attack pockets of Wehrmacht troops. He told his men: "There is no land past the Volga" - and awaited the arrival of the 6th Army in Stalingrad. Chuikov and Paulus fought for Stalingrad for 5 months. Chuikov wrote: "The Germans underestimated our artillery. And they underestimated the effectiveness of our infantry against their tanks. This battle showed that tanks forced to operate in narrow quarters are of limited value; they’re just guns without mobility. In such conditions nothing can take the place of small groups of infantry, properly armed, and fighting with utmost determination -- groups converting every building into a fortress and fighting for it floor by floor and even room by room. Such defenders cannot be driven out either by tanks or planes." When Chuikov had fought Paulus' 6th Army to a standstill, Zhukov's pincer attack isolated the German 6th Army. Russia had gained the initiative in the War. Chuikov was the Russian General closest to Hitler's bunker when he committed suicide. He received the German surrender of Berlin on 1st May 1945.
@iplaygames8090
@iplaygames8090 Рік тому
Fought 2 times for the same city
@seth4607
@seth4607 5 років тому
So in short the Soviets held their officers accountable for their actions, and tried to revitalized the fighting spirit of all their armies by setting forth the immense importance of standing firm, against an extremely overstretched enemy, who view their land as nothing more than free real estate. It's as if the Soviet leadership might actually be capable of making rational decisions based on the given circumstances... Awesome video man! And thanks for breaking a huge misconception!
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Pretty much, yes. All actions can be rationalized. Usually, if we can't rationalize them, it means we're missing something - either evidence or context or perspective.
@chrisvalcu7228
@chrisvalcu7228 5 років тому
Are we comparing Soviet atrocities from WWII to US atrocities from the Vietnam or Iraq wars? That would be fair, since only US angels and Good Samaritans have fought in WWII
@cannonfodder4376
@cannonfodder4376 5 років тому
The first comprehensive video debunking this myth I have ever seen on UKposts. Well done.
@coreymicallef365
@coreymicallef365 5 років тому
Cannonfodder43 have you seen one somewhere else?
@cannonfodder4376
@cannonfodder4376 5 років тому
Corey Micallef Nope, this is the first.
@XXX-qk2cq
@XXX-qk2cq 5 років тому
How is the myth debunked? 227 stated that retreat would be met with death. Officers or soldiers alike. How is this a myth? Stalin ordered it in 227 as this video states. It was a reality. Of course this video author needs a subject but it appears he is attempting to show that it was the officers who were retreating and not the soldiers. Stalin clearly believed the officers could and should stop the soldiers from retreating and if they didn’t it would be on their head. The soldiers and officers retreated in the face of certain death. This retreat obviously did not last after 227. Does this author have another agenda, perhaps to rewrite history? I hope not.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
I have replied to your other message explaining (again) why Order 227 wasn't how you think it was S S. And I intend to rewrite history. Revising history is not a bad thing ukposts.info/have/v-deo/qqWiqG6srZWQkmw.html
@VESTIT112EST
@VESTIT112EST 5 років тому
you are tring to rewrite history or you are a apologist for the communists.Order 227 clearly mentioned soldiers who retreated must be killed.Watch your own video :D
@dinarichyperborean1455
@dinarichyperborean1455 Рік тому
So basically, the commissars that shot soviet soliders in "enemy at the gates" were the ones that would have been punished by the order in real life.
@seanmurphy7845
@seanmurphy7845 4 роки тому
Honestly, history surrounding the Soviet's and Nazi's is often the most interesting, specifically when you attempt to get a firmer, rounded grasp of events.
@BtheLee11
@BtheLee11 5 років тому
After watching this i can actually understand this order. It's not "not a step back or else we'll shoot you" it's more like "i'm sick of my officers disobeying my commands and the commands of their superiors". In the US army if you do go AWOL and actually abandoned you could be subject to prison time and/or be convicted of treason (which to my knowledge is a death sentence).
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Exactly, this order was a management technique to sort out the middle-managers who were allowing retreats. And it worked. Yes, it was also bloody, but it was deemed necessary.
@joshuasitzema9920
@joshuasitzema9920 Рік тому
It's only an executable offense in war time or if you aided the enemy after deserting. Otherwise it's simply a very long prison sentence and record that prevents anyone from hiring you except the most basic of jobs.
@BlitzOfTheReich
@BlitzOfTheReich 5 років тому
'Germany invades the Soviet Union in June of 1942.' Yo are you getting enough sleep from that Stalingrad doc?
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Haha what is sleep!?
@user-sg9qw4ig9q
@user-sg9qw4ig9q 5 років тому
Germany invades the Soviet Union in June 22 in 1941 not 1942....that's important
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Yeah, I know, I simply misspoke. Sorry
@sushimuncher282
@sushimuncher282 5 років тому
Speaker: *(mistakenly said 1 number off)* Everyone: REEEEEEEEE
@BlitzOfTheReich
@BlitzOfTheReich 5 років тому
hue hue hue
@wckvn
@wckvn 5 років тому
That is historically accurate... Unfortunately, history has been re-written also in Russia. At least in schools, it is thought as imagery of Stalin maniac behavior. As an officer, I can tell you that, if you tried everything and nothing works, Order 227 it is. Thanks for bringing the stats of population. It was very helpful. With all that being said, that Axis population gratefully outnumbered unoccupied Soviet population, and also being a step behind, it is sort of a miracle that Soviets got through next 3 years.
@Free_Palestine_419
@Free_Palestine_419 5 років тому
I mean Stalin is a bloodthirsty monster but he's not an idiot.
@heyman2480
@heyman2480 5 років тому
That's how propaganda work
@nottoday3817
@nottoday3817 4 роки тому
Wait, in Russian schools Stalin is portrayed as a maniac? Isn't he portrayed as a great hero and the unsung father of Vladimir?
@nyusa78
@nyusa78 4 роки тому
@@Free_Palestine_419 oh yeah you're right Stalin massacred 10 million Peaceful Vietnamese Buddhist people in an effort to create a Christian country in Far East Asia.
@nanouasyn
@nanouasyn 4 роки тому
​@@nottoday3817 wat?)) sorry for my english but i must answer to that comment. i hope you understand me even if i ignore some grammar rules. now life of people gets worse every day, prices are rising, mass education and medicine is deteriorating, science getting deeper and deeper in the ass, the rich get richer, the poor get poorer. the government does nothing, just serves the rich and steals from the poor. they stole everything from us under the guise of freedom and democracy. but their democracy is the power of only rich minority. since russia became capitalist country, we have no achievements, no climbs, no reasons to be proud. we have only a slow decay. it is not profitable for the government to remind people of this. therefore, they lies, slander their predecessors to look good compared to them. stalin was poor but he was great because he spent his life in the service of the people. putin is rich but he is pathetic because he is s a puppet serving oligarchs. and people see it. not all people, but more and more. so people look back and compare. the only way to fight this is to lie about the past until people believe it. so, the government is in a stupid situation. they need to support patriotism in people, but patriotism should be based on something. either on the achievements of modernity or on the achievements of the past. the greatest achievements of the past are associated with communism but communism is hostile to this new state so it is dangerous to tell about them. so propaganda becomes schizophrenic. in some cases it repeats the propaganda of the west, in other cases repeats the fascist propaganda, in other cases repeats the soviet propaganda, trying to sit on many chairs simultaneously. to exclude from usa propaganda words about modern russia. to exclude from fascist propaganda words about jews. to exclude from soviet propaganda words about communism - that's how we get modern controversial propaganda.
@maxspirin3945
@maxspirin3945 4 роки тому
Blocking detachments, penal units and execution for cowardice in military existed throughout the history of humanity, with first records of such practices probably since ancient Romans. Western media always portraits Soviets as the only one side who implemented them, implying that Soviets didn’t have that level of moral and bravery as Germans or any other side of that war.. But the fun fact: Germans formed such units and battalions half a year BEFORE Soviets, after failure of operation Typhoon Here is the extract from the same order #227, that follows the one that TIK cited here, urging to copy Germans [After the winter retreat under pressure of the Red Army, when in German troops discipline became loose, the Germans for recovery of discipline imposed severe measures which resulted in quite good outcomes. They formed 100 penal companies from soldiers who were guilty of breaches of discipline because of cowardice or bewilderment, put them at dangerous sections of the front and commanded them to redeem their sins by blood. They have also formed approximately ten penal battalions from commanders guilty of breaches of discipline through cowardice or bewilderment, deprived them of their decorations, transferred them to even more dangerous sections of the front and commanded them to redeem their sins. Finally, they have formed special squads and put them behind unstable divisions and ordered them to shoot panic-mongers in case of unauthorized retreats or attempted surrender. As we know, these measures were effective, and now German troops fight better than they fought in the winter. And here is the situation, that the German troops have good discipline, though they do not have the high purpose of protection of the Motherland, and have only one extortionate purpose - to subdue another's country, and our troops have the higher purpose of protecting the abused Motherland,and do not have such discipline and so suffer defeat. Is it necessary for us to learn from our enemies, as our grandparents studied their enemies in the past and achieved victory? I think it is necessary.”] (And the link for entire text: en.m.wikisource.org/wiki/Translation:Order_No._227_by_the_People%27s_Commissar_of_Defence_of_the_USSR
@KarakuraRiser
@KarakuraRiser 5 років тому
22:54 be like: "Dude im fighting a war what's with the camera?"
@svanse45.56
@svanse45.56 4 роки тому
Mavi means "Blue" in Turkish.
@thedynamicdoggo4155
@thedynamicdoggo4155 4 роки тому
Svanse45.5 NOBODY CARES
@antoniovillanueva308
@antoniovillanueva308 5 років тому
Wow, a man in pursuit of truth. Subbed.
@avi1212avi
@avi1212avi 4 роки тому
And actually posses the intelect to do so! Double down on the red button.
@Tina06019
@Tina06019 3 роки тому
Me too.
@baltulielkungsgunarsmiezis9714
@baltulielkungsgunarsmiezis9714 3 роки тому
He sumarises what is written in books, not what actually happened.
@antoniovillanueva308
@antoniovillanueva308 3 роки тому
@@baltulielkungsgunarsmiezis9714 no ancient man can speak to me. The human voice is but waves of compressed air in a fluid that rapidly disseminates energy. I can only know what is written.
@baltulielkungsgunarsmiezis9714
@baltulielkungsgunarsmiezis9714 3 роки тому
@@antoniovillanueva308 History books are written by the victors, oral hisotry is remmebered by the survivors.
@connorwilson2014
@connorwilson2014 5 років тому
Those in back cry forward Those in front cry back
@connorwilson2014
@connorwilson2014 5 років тому
The existence of one tragedy does not negate the sadness of another. Your statement is shit.
@rubydog25
@rubydog25 5 років тому
@Majco lmao 6 billion
@neieduardodepaula4556
@neieduardodepaula4556 4 роки тому
@@connorwilson2014 This video you are commenting at is explanining that there is no "Those in back cry forward Those in front cry back". Have you watched a single minute of it?
@followerofeir
@followerofeir 4 роки тому
Nei Eduardo De Paula there was another comment that got deleted
@agentc7020
@agentc7020 4 роки тому
And those that cry back will eventually lose so you choose your poison
@justchary
@justchary 3 роки тому
Well done, man! Thank you on behalf of my grandfather, who fought there!
@skys6655
@skys6655 5 років тому
Soldier: shit i forgot my ammo back there. Stalin: not a step back!
@volvob1884
@volvob1884 4 роки тому
Funny....?
@volvob1884
@volvob1884 4 роки тому
@@BeansMan62 What does that even mean?
@Ian-pm2ly
@Ian-pm2ly 4 роки тому
Bruh the soldiers would be shot.
@youngcynical3084
@youngcynical3084 4 роки тому
@@volvob1884 when the Red Army's soldiers are so afriad of being killed you have to make an order to execute 'em when they are retreating.
@maxstone2380
@maxstone2380 4 роки тому
@@volvob1884 Salty that you didn't understand a very simple joke that anyone would get?
@mcmoose64
@mcmoose64 5 років тому
UKposts needs more sites like this . Well researched with references to back up conclusions .I didn't think such things permitted on the internet .
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
There's nothing to prevent such things, but it requires a lot of work. The internet is still in the new "this is a toy" stage which many of the old establishment (media, book authors, TV 'experts' and so on) look down up or see as 'bad'. I firmly believe that we will one day soon progress beyond the old mentality and enter into a new era whereby the internet is the dominant place for entertainment, education, shopping, industry...
@meeeka
@meeeka 3 роки тому
you Tube is sliding into the business of entertaining teenagers.
@Matthew-jr6nf
@Matthew-jr6nf 2 роки тому
I honestly had never given any thought to questioning the popular version of this particular historical flashpoint. Thanks for enlightening me!
@brahim119
@brahim119 4 роки тому
You are wonderful human being. You channel's content if one of the best on YT. Thank you for sharing.
@nomcognom2332
@nomcognom2332 5 років тому
But, but... Generals memories about aryan superiority versus infinite asiatic hordes :(
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
The reality doesn't fit the dream
@kategrant2728
@kategrant2728 5 років тому
More like a nightmare.
@russianmovieswithenglishsu4128
@russianmovieswithenglishsu4128 5 років тому
Generals cannot lie, nor can fiction movies.
@djvdtweel
@djvdtweel 5 років тому
No one is saying this is true its just a meme, dont talk for others.
@HaloFTW55
@HaloFTW55 5 років тому
With careful deployment, you can achieve a 2:1 ratio over the enemy in localized areas with smaller numbers than the enemy. Which really says that either the Soviets were good at redeploying their troops, or the Soviets were very good at keeping their troop movement hidden. Maybe all of the above.
@user-zc3qx9hs4j
@user-zc3qx9hs4j 5 років тому
As a Russian, I can't but express my gratitude to you for your great job in debunking those myths about the most smeared war in history. For those who still believe in evil Soviet commissars who shot their soldiers for no reason, here's the statistics compiled by NKVD from August to October 1942: "..detained: 140 755 soldiers who fled from the frontline. Of this number: arrested: 3 980 people; executed: 1 189 people; sent to penal companies: 2 776 people; sent to penal battalions: 185 people; returned to their units: 131 094 people." But of course, all the executed people were innocent victims of the bloody NKVD, and not traitors, panic-mongers and spies that easily disappeared among retreating masses. Jokes aside, I am shocked how lazy people are. There are many reliable sources of information, but it's easier for people to believe in myths and propaganda images. Also, I think it should be mentioned that penal battalions were only for the officers while penal companies consisted of regular soldiers. It is a popular misconception in our country that there were only penal battalions that consisted of regular soldiers mixed in with officers. Anyway, thanks again for the great vid. Keep fighting the wicked propaganda.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
My pleasure, and I'm glad you enjoyed the video :) I agree, the biggest problem is the propaganda which distorts the truth. Without the truth we cannot make informed decisions.
@SingapurRUS
@SingapurRUS 5 років тому
Solzhenitsyn can be a source of information only for an ignorant fool. Sorry. I understand why he is perceived as a person who speaks the truth: because he was against communist power, and the communist government was against him, which means he was telling the truth. Such a logic.
@SingapurRUS
@SingapurRUS 5 років тому
You underestimate the literary talent of this man, friend. Admit that you believe him only for the reason that I named.
@SingapurRUS
@SingapurRUS 5 років тому
Your unskillful and dull demagogy upsets me.
@pavelZhd
@pavelZhd 5 років тому
The most upsetting thing with all those myth of NKVD being monsters, is the fact that border defence units in USSR were NKVD so they were the first to take the blow, and there are numerous examples of heroic defence. But all people remember when hearing NKVD is penal batallions and blocking units...
@ChertovBaobab
@ChertovBaobab 4 роки тому
Oh wow. That's a lot of interesting info. Спасибо!
@nealthomas8836
@nealthomas8836 5 років тому
Another extremely insightful analysis. I wish I'd found the TIK channel sooner!
@patrickholt2270
@patrickholt2270 5 років тому
There was an infantry platoon which was ordered to operate as a blocking detatchment on the edge of the British right or left defending Dunkirk, to stop any soldiers from retreating rather than fighting to the last bullet, because of the need to give the troops on the beach as long as possible to retreat. It was showcased in a BBC docudrama about Dunkirk about 15 years ago, in which they did in fact shoot dead an officer trying to retreat past them.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Seriously? I didn't know that. Do you have any sources??
@patrickholt2270
@patrickholt2270 5 років тому
No. It's just what I recollect seeing in this particular docudrama. I'll try and find the clip if possible.
@patrickholt2270
@patrickholt2270 5 років тому
It seeems to be well paywalled off, but I believe the scene takes place in episode 3 ("Deliverance") of the 2004 BBC series. I am trusting their research - the claim is made that all the events shown come from eyewitness testimony or document records.
@jackofshadows8538
@jackofshadows8538 5 років тому
Yes, I know the one you mean. The Colonel of, I think, Coldstream Guards? orders the Platoon CO next to him to hold his position and if he sees ANY of the CO's men pass a certain tree then he would order his unit to fire upon those men... which they did and killed or wounded at least 2 British soldiers. The Germans were advancing with Infantry only. German troops use French farmers & civilians as human shields to advance toward the farmhouse the British unit was defending but the crackshot of the platoon and the Lt. were both still picking off German troops even with their French human shields so the German troops gave up that attempt BUT had managed to drop mortars exactly onto the building where they were sniping from, injuring them. The Lt. was badly injured and carried to the beach at Dunkirk but Churchill's order to abandon the wounded to show he was equally fair in getting his French allies off the beach meant the Lt [Lieutenant] was left sitting slumped against a tree and when the Germans eventually marched passed him he asked one of them in German what did he want and the German replied, "Marmalad" [British='jam'] after handing him his cigarette to smoke. The British Lt laughs in tears at this. I don't recall the actor's name but he was very young at this time. He went on to play a modern Sherlock Holmes.
@patrickholt2270
@patrickholt2270 5 років тому
Thank you. Your memory is clearly better than mine. Benedict Cumberbatch, I believe.
@andresvega6001
@andresvega6001 5 років тому
Damn i wasn't expecting this kind of analisys, this is great man. Keep it up!
@S.Hunter279
@S.Hunter279 4 роки тому
Very informative video. I find it interesting that Stalin actually employed the ideas and tactics Hitler had allegedly used to prevent the collapse of the front before Moscow against his arch foe. The order itself reveals Stalin's awareness of the fact that the Battle of Stalingrad was the decisive moment of the war in the East and what happened there would determine the outcome. What I don't undestand yet is why Hitler didn't arrive at the same conclusion and threw everything he had in order to win. I certainly need to watch more of these videos to solve this doubt.
@puaro2909
@puaro2909 4 роки тому
The Wehrmacht was the first to form about a hundred penal companies, consisting of fighters guilty of breach of discipline by cowardice or instability, put them on dangerous sections of the front and ordered them to “atone with blood”. By the way, the Soviet detachments did not shoot any of the machine guns. And they were not directly on the front line, they were located in the frontline zone and guarded the rear from saboteurs and, yes, they caught the deserters. In the vast majority of cases it was caught, for the tribunal. The detachments were in almost all the armies of the world, but they are called differently. For example, there are cases when Dutch officers stopped retreating soldiers with machine gun fire
@tophernolastname2378
@tophernolastname2378 Рік тому
I did some research, and I couldn't find any information on the Wermacht having blocking detachments. The notion they were used by "all armies of the world" is a canard. Soldiers could get shot for retreating, true, but this is very different from an actual blocking detachment. When someone retreats & is caught, there implicitly leaves the reasonable doubt that both sides are aware of, that you may have just gotten lost & are on your way back to your unit. This is very different from a dug-in trench with machine guns posted & thousands of men being used on them instead of fighting at the front-- placed near the frontlines (so the soldiers can't "get lost")-- in order to concentrate the offense like a group of men being pushed off a cliff.
@puaro2909
@puaro2909 Рік тому
@@tophernolastname2378 about Nazy German army - Strafbataillon, 999. Afrika-Brigade, you can read about them in eng wiki (if you want, I can add a link, just in case). Poor armed, sent as punishment. About a catching lost soldiers and killing them immediately - no one did that. For the first half of 1941, NKVD caught 657 364 lost soldiers; from them: 25 878 got arrested (yes, 10 201 executed) and others 632 486 were just sent to their units (from an official NKVD report to Stalin, you can find it easily too (can give you a link if you want)). And no one sent soldiers without any weapon against machine guns - penal battalions and blocking detachments in the Soviet army (I don't know about others, didn't check) were equipped better than the main units, cause they fought in important dangerous areas of the front. About "every army", yeah, I agree, went too far, but claiming only the USSR for that is wrong too.
@jimivey6462
@jimivey6462 5 років тому
All too often, historical situations are taught in a simplistic manner. This has certainly been the case with respect to order 227. Thank you for this valuable video.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
You're very welcome, thanks for watching :)
@alongwaystogo
@alongwaystogo 5 років тому
eye opening for me, thanks
@mikeshoults4155
@mikeshoults4155 Рік тому
I can't believe that here in 2022 we are seeing Russia repeat order 227
@Brslld
@Brslld Рік тому
Because the russian army is a paper military LOL.
@ghostrider.49
@ghostrider.49 5 років тому
I just love how you destroy these myths one by one. Well done, I like before watching because I know it will be good!
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Well, I'm not sure if I did destroy a myth. I think I destroyed a false-perception, rather than a myth. But either way, I hope you enjoy the video :)
@ghostrider.49
@ghostrider.49 5 років тому
TIK Well yeah I did indeed express myself wrongly. Cheers!
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Sources I used are listed in the pinned comment.
@soulscanner66
@soulscanner66 5 років тому
You post sources, but you don't write books or papers that can be scrutinized by these authors; you make UKpostss along with PewDiePie and have them commented on mostly by neo-Nazis, communists, grumpy old men, Russian trolls with multimple accounts, Holocaust deniers, and junior high-schoolers. You use a propagandists medium, not one wehre your claims can be subject to serious scrutiny.
@sebastiancarreira1656
@sebastiancarreira1656 5 років тому
Wow, this guy has less than 50K subscribers! Good and comprehensive explainations, good and clear voice, english subs for non native speakers, good editing. New favorite history UKposts channel!
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Well, I'm glad you're impressed! The only videos that won't have English subtitles will be my Q&A videos, because they're not scripted and I don't/won't have time to subtitle them unfortunately, but the rest will be subtitled. If you liked this video, be sure to check out my Battlestorm videos because they're my best-quality videos and the ones that many of my subscribers are waiting for (my latest ones are the better quality ones - also I'm currently working on Battlestorms Operation Crusader and Stalingrad) ukposts.info/slow/PLNSNgGzaledgHIszXQVDreX-ZC1Xejf9Y
@mariyanadobreva8724
@mariyanadobreva8724 4 роки тому
Thank you for this video. Finally, a balanced view. I learned many things I didn't know. And for those who critisize you, I would like to quote the opinion of Régis de Castelnau, a French journalist. (I hope my translation is good, my English is not as good as my French) : to dislike socialism and the Soviet Union is one thing, and to falsify historical truth, is another. The first is strictly an individual right, the second is called propaganda. (and for hose who would jump to conclusions, based on my family name, I am Canadian, and NOT of Russian origin).
@worldoftancraft
@worldoftancraft 4 роки тому
Your quote is wrong. All, that people translate in minds of other people - is propoganda. So, it ain't bad, propoganda - is just a fact: it can to propagandize good, it can do ze same with bad things. Promoting of healthy lifestyle - have you heard that? But what about if we'll change the first word? But, but, but, the falsifying the history is a propoganda, with distinctive expressed reasons, and, of course, with very certain people behind it, with, right how it supposed to and should be, certain interests in their heads. And, what do you think happens there, in ze moza Russia? The same propoganda. Yes it is. And it just happens despite of constitutional article about prohibition of states Ideology & Propoganda.
@mariyanadobreva8724
@mariyanadobreva8724 3 роки тому
You are right. everything is propaganda. But my quote is not wrong. These are the exact words of the French journalist. And speaking of healthy lifestyle, you know very well the garbage some people put under this title (different diets and dubious practices in the name of health). I don't know exactly what happens in Mother Russia, I am not a fan of Mr. Putin, but I know that the world is very much indebted to the Soviet people for their sacrifices during WW2.
@generallyupsetfetus
@generallyupsetfetus 3 роки тому
Personally, I think the misconception of the Soviet’s suicidal charges were from the fact that they did usually have to push forwards, because the most famous moments of the Eastern front were the counter offensives.
@mahobgood30
@mahobgood30 5 років тому
While they weren't entirely fighting out of fear, I still personally think that it played a big factor considering Stalins' policy of "fall in line or it's gulag time.". But over all I think it was more of the well known fact that people don't like having their front door kicked in told what to do expecially by germans.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
"Fall in line or it's Gulag Time" - amazing! I'm liberating that :D
@blugaledoh2669
@blugaledoh2669 5 років тому
Lol, good line.
@CharcharoExplorer
@CharcharoExplorer 5 років тому
The July Wehraboo offensive will begin soon. Hope you are ready man :D Good video!
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
They must attack in summer; they're weak in the winter.
@fuzzydunlop7928
@fuzzydunlop7928 5 років тому
They're weak in general, General, generally speaking they don't get out more than once a week.
@skinni45
@skinni45 5 років тому
How dare he, doesn't he know that Stalin killed 54878294 bajillion of his own people?
@ezequielstepanenko3229
@ezequielstepanenko3229 5 років тому
Let's not forget he caused a famine in neptune that exterminated the reptilian population from the planet and that he executed 150 millons of martians, and he ate at least sixteen babies per day
@MinecraftWithPAPike
@MinecraftWithPAPike 5 років тому
skinni45 are you really defending Stalin
@babisdr
@babisdr 3 роки тому
Really glad that I stumbled upon this channel. Great content. Thank you.
@dennisweidner288
@dennisweidner288 Рік тому
These videos, especially the Russian losses never address why the Russian casualties were so much higher than the German casualties. Here I am not just talking about Brvarissa (1941), but throughout the Ostkrieg. And even in the great Russin victories, their losses were enormous. Of course, there were many factors, but there was one overriding factor, and the Soviets as well as the Russians today do not want to admit it.
@niklasklasen8048
@niklasklasen8048 5 років тому
Well, unfortunately, 99% of people who watch the movie won't see this video. They will believe the movie as if the things depicted were true. My dad himself was upset over the friendly fire during the first assault in the film. I explained how it wasnt true but you could tell anti Soviet propaganda lives on.
@duhwhiz
@duhwhiz 5 років тому
Nicely explained. History is usually misunderstood and thus biased.
@Olegstuff21986
@Olegstuff21986 4 роки тому
History is usually written by the "victor".
@thethirdman225
@thethirdman225 3 роки тому
Jesus Christ... Did either of you watch the video?
@unclelarry8842
@unclelarry8842 2 роки тому
@@Olegstuff21986 uhhh hello? Franz fucking Halder? Erich Manstein? The countless books, recounts, autobiographies and memoirs of German generals & soldiers that was considered as highly valuable and trustworthy sources in the west? (well up until the Russians finally told their side of story after the CW)
@Olegstuff21986
@Olegstuff21986 2 роки тому
@@unclelarry8842 Right, and Goebbels is also a 'very credible source', right? Since his version of what happened in Katyn is the one believed in the West to this day.
@unclelarry8842
@unclelarry8842 2 роки тому
@@Olegstuff21986 didn't you read my comment? I said *WAS* considered trustworthy everything changed after the Russians told their side of the story after the CW (Cold War) after that people started questioning the credibility of their German sources. Hell if it wasn't for them we wouldn't have gotten such idiocy like Enemy at The Gates.
@solomonrivers2882
@solomonrivers2882 4 роки тому
I love stumbling onto a smaller channel with quality sources videos, Keep it up brother
@tvanb8729
@tvanb8729 4 роки тому
You must be put on TV man, the way you give is the information is so good. It's so clear, NG must hire you and don't change a thing!
@chepushila1
@chepushila1 5 років тому
I mean the British never particular liked Russia. Why are historians like Beevor are even taken seriously?
@MyOrangeString
@MyOrangeString 5 років тому
Hey, at 2:00 you say "millions would die of starvation". I first thought "no way". I couldn't get a clear figure for number of Ukranian who died of starvation during the German occupation, because the Soviets did some damage themselves, but after some light internet digging it seems to be 5 to 7 millions dead to hunger and disease. I. can't. believe. this. They lost something like 20% of their population total (military + civilian).
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
My question is, if you didn't know, how many other people didn't know either?
@dronfim
@dronfim 5 років тому
Do you consider doing video on German atrocities against Soviet population?
@DIEGhostfish
@DIEGhostfish 5 років тому
Poor Ukraine, starved by the Soviets, then starved by the Nazis.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Seven, it isn't "modern propaganda". It's a well known and documented event.
@ruthenius682
@ruthenius682 5 років тому
Second that. It is one of the best sources that can be found in English. Unfortunately, there are too little good translation of Russian researches on the subject.
@tacowilco7515
@tacowilco7515 5 років тому
0:29 : "Germany invades Soviet Union in June 1942" Yikes!!!
@GAtTheTop
@GAtTheTop 4 роки тому
Mistakes. They happen.
@johnhungerford6073
@johnhungerford6073 4 роки тому
My ears were bleeding 🤪
@peterthorell586
@peterthorell586 4 роки тому
June 41 22/6
@mhern57
@mhern57 4 роки тому
@@GAtTheTop Yup.
@SorryBadName
@SorryBadName 4 роки тому
Peter Thorell 42*
@KoyaSRB
@KoyaSRB 4 роки тому
Great lecture. It is time that someone say that!!!
@EstellammaSS
@EstellammaSS 5 років тому
You can hate Stalin, hate the Soviet Union, but you can not deny the fact that the only reason we can live our life this way is because the bloods shed by those brave souls. I simply cannot understand how naive does one have to be to disregard their sacrifices. The record has to be set straight. For their faults and for their rights. The soldiers of the Soviet Union deserve their respect. Thank you for doing this TIK, now whenever I saw someone spitting the enemy at the gates crap again I can just link the video.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
I think the reason is because people think in absolutes. "If the Soviets did better, this must mean the US didn't do as well!?!?" No, it doesn't work like that. There's not a finite amount of praise. Praising one nation does not take away from another. It just adds to the total amount of praise.
@mhern57
@mhern57 5 років тому
TIK Well said. It saddens me, (upsets me really) that even after 70 plus years too many comments on these videos take the tone of "my team is better than yours"! mentality. Those types of comments might be fun in football but have no place here.
@useodyseeorbitchute9450
@useodyseeorbitchute9450 5 років тому
@Graff That what you said is as true as appreciating sacrifice of common German soldiers, whose sacrifice blunted down communism march on Europe in cold war. Technically speaking sort of true, just in both cases overlooks a genocidal totalitarian regime that they served which started that war in September 1939.
@russianspy5307
@russianspy5307 5 років тому
So many people argue about which nation won the war and i'm just thinking "you realise it was a combines effort right?".
@noland65
@noland65 5 років тому
TIK, also, a major ignorance regarding the losses, sacrifices and enormous devastations suffered by the USSR in WWII was an important precondition of some of the cold war narratives.
@ernestw2474
@ernestw2474 5 років тому
Comrade Vasily Chuikov, the time has come. Execute order 227.
@feitopuns
@feitopuns 5 років тому
everybody knows stalin is a sith
@miklyeryomin1433
@miklyeryomin1433 5 років тому
@Scott Johnstone actualy in Russia we have 228 state in crime codex and it is about drug dealing. And it is memed like 420 in us. So i find order 228 funny.
@duylai2224
@duylai2224 5 років тому
i sense a great disturbance in the East
@TheSevez
@TheSevez 5 років тому
Really enjoyed the Video. Would love to see more
@premitive1
@premitive1 5 років тому
First video I've seen of yours. Great! Subscribed.
@radja5608
@radja5608 5 років тому
Thank you for explaining about order 227 and what really happened. I subscribed
@amityexe8326
@amityexe8326 5 років тому
He fought by my side from the siege of Stalingrad to the fall of Berlin like of you know where this is from
@bazcain4124
@bazcain4124 4 роки тому
Pope Of the church of tea call of duty duh
@Vchk1917
@Vchk1917 2 роки тому
When I was a kid and watched this movie, I didn't get it why this movie was hated in Russia, and I wondered if it had to do with the fact it was made in the west or something. But now I get it why, and actually agree with them.
@mikehector4197
@mikehector4197 4 роки тому
Really enjoyed this, thank you. 'The Road to Stalingrad' by Ericcson is a great read :)
@rebelrun6137
@rebelrun6137 5 років тому
Well done, this vid got a sub. Informed and you get the information across at ease. Not being able to see you read a script keeps us immerse. Anyone can research facts and read them back, while your videos give the felling that you are the informed teacher and we are the students. Nothing worse than a teacher that has to look at the book while he gives the lesson. Cheers
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Wow thank you Rebel :) glad you liked the video!
@Tribun1211
@Tribun1211 5 років тому
Just here as promised on Sunday in the VIP Arena of Gaming Awards at Tankfest.....was nice to meet you and thank your for the long talk....cant wait for the upcoming videos - GnomeRanger from FILO
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Hey mate, yes it was good to meet you too and chat! I told you this video would spark a debate ;) Good luck to you and your clan!
@user-mm8rq7en4e
@user-mm8rq7en4e 3 роки тому
Fun fact: ENEMY AT THE GATE was directed by a French, whose ancestors actually imposed similar policy during WW I.
@lilestojkovicii6618
@lilestojkovicii6618 2 роки тому
Oh the irony
@danielveselic8677
@danielveselic8677 8 місяців тому
This is a goated channel. I am really interested in the history, especially the second world war, therefore, thank you so much for covering all these topics. It is really helpful for me to grasp the understatement of what was really going on.
@squamish4244
@squamish4244 5 років тому
Stalingrad was actually called "The Red Verdun" at the time, due to the similar hold-at-all-costs attitude and the ferocity of the combat in a relatively small area.
@Free_Palestine_419
@Free_Palestine_419 5 років тому
Except Stalingrad was a 100 times bloodier and worse than verdun. Stalingrad is the most bloodiest battle in ww2 and one of the most bloodiest in human history.
@tamasmarcuis4455
@tamasmarcuis4455 5 років тому
I read a part of a German description of the Russian front and saw something quickly that made no sense. The Germans always claimed they were outnumbered everywhere and that was why they lost. My own military training told me you could only ever be so out numbered on your part of the front. Clearly the Germans were static and the Soviets moving and defeating the Germans in detail. But it seems the Germans got to write the history that was read by the Western military. So much for history being written by the victors.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
That's the way I see it too, going off the sources. The Germans often outnumbered the Soviets at the tactical level in 1941-1942.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Do you have a source for your claim that 2 million Soviets surrounded the 6th Army at Stalingrad? I think you'll find that it was much less than that. Also, Paulus's 6th Army outnumbered Chuikov's 62nd Army throughout the Battle of Stalingrad and yet managed to hold out for several months.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
So hold on, first you said that 2 million held the 6th Army in Stalingrad. Now you've revised that, and are now saying that the 6th Army killed 1.4 million Soviets on its own, and then just 600,000 Soviets held the 300,000 6th Army inside the pocket. Let me point out a few problems with this. First you've made an outlandish claim, and insulted two people by calling them retards for not knowing that this _claim_ was clearly true. Now, when you were called out on it, you've revised your numbers (showing that your stance is deeply flawed). These revised numbers are taken out from the wider context, which is vitally important, and without which it leads people to the incorrect conclusions. Second, Glantz places the total number of men in the Fronts participating in the Stalingrad counteroffensive (Operation Uranus) as 1,042,218. [Table 11, Endgame at Stalingrad]. Not all of these man would have been committed to the offensive. Even if they were, that's not 2 million men, nor 1.4 million. Third, the 6th Army was trapped in the pocket (and numbers vary for that) and let's assume it was 300,000 for a moment. Ok, but it wasn't 2 million vs 300,000. Because we know that it was 300,000 trapped in the pocket AFTER the offensive. Third Romanian Army was 155,000 men strong, Romanian forces under Fourth Panzer Army were 75,000 men strong, Fourth Panzer Army was somewhere in the region of 33,000, Sixth Army was 175,776 men strong. For opposing forces during Uranus, Glantz lists the total numbers in Table 23 as 1,042,218 Soviets (782,548 combat troops) vs 521,703 (234,252 combat). Fourth, context is key. Just because the Soviets outnumber the Axis here does not mean they always outnumbered them. As I mentioned, 6th Army outnumbered Chuikov's army throughout the battle in the previous three months. Is it the Soviets' fault that they carefully husbanded their forces to mount a carefully planned counteroffensive? I don't think so, considering that the Germans were sending their reinforcements to Army Groups North and Centre during this period. So, as you can see, I have done my research. You assume that I'm not working on my own Stalingrad documentary, and that I haven't done over 400,000 words of research so far. Don't assume that someone doesn't know what they're talking about. What you should have done in this case is asked for clarification rather than calling people "retarded". Now onto your other points. 3,957,910 well prepared and equipped Axis troops strike 2,743,000 surprised, unprepared and ill-equipped Soviet troops on the 22nd of June 1941. The Soviets are overwhelmed and throw in reserves piecemeal against superior Axis numbers to get slaughtered, and the Axis capture 3 million Soviet prisoners, then starve them to death in the Reich's labour camps. And this shows you that the Germans are superior somehow? No, the Soviets were outnumbered until December 1941. Then it takes them a while to recover from this devastation, which they only do fully by the Kursk era. So this is an unfair comparison simply because the Soviets were unexpectedly struck by the Germans in 1941. Because of this they always fought with a handicap until they wrestled the initiative off the Germans, which they did during Stalingrad. Therefore this isn't "superiority" on the German side. All it proves is that they got the first blow in. And by Kursk, the tide of war had changed long ago.
@fulcrum2951
@fulcrum2951 5 років тому
@valhalla awaits i doubt your ancestry is from polish/lithuania anyways and no it doesn't justify misinformation anyways
@vdagr8795
@vdagr8795 3 роки тому
I can't believe that so many Americans believe that propaganda movie lmao
@ottomeyer6928
@ottomeyer6928 3 роки тому
give them some popcorn and they believe everything
@BackSeatHump
@BackSeatHump 3 роки тому
I believe it. I lived in the U.S. several years.
@AlexLee-dc2vb
@AlexLee-dc2vb 5 років тому
Well shit... and I thought that the education 8 year old me got from the Stalingrad level of CoD Classic was pretty solid
@adamskinner5868
@adamskinner5868 5 років тому
Great video and interesting history as always, thanks. I saw an interview (as I'm sure others have) with a soldier from a Red Army Penal battalion around Stalingrad. He was there because he had as a civilian questioned why his teacher was being arrested. Others were there because they had been late to report for work in a factory (a criminal offense). He talked about his group being sent forward to test and expose the German defenses before the main attack while officers observed. He knew his only hope of survival was to be wounded and pay his debt in blood but was worried that his first 2 wounds were perhaps not serious enough to allow him to stop attacking without risking being shot as a coward. As for the numbers quoted surely these need to be taken more as estimates as the Red army conscripted males of fighting age from the territories they liberated and not all were documented before being killed as they were used as front line troops suffering high casualties.
@hyljix
@hyljix 4 роки тому
Finland wasn't in the Axis..... Finland, was just Finland..
@sebastiantiainen2749
@sebastiantiainen2749 4 роки тому
Well the thing is that we got material help from the Germans, we had a common enemy with the Germans and we fought together in some operations on the Finnish front. It's quite hard to not say that we weren't axis in the grand scheme of things because at the end of the day we helped the axis. So while we had our own differences with the Soviets, in the context of the second world war we fought on the axis side, so while not being fully committed to the Axis war effort, we still relied quite a lot on Axis victory over the Soviets. However it's important to note that we weren't at war with the western allies except on paper. The British bombed Petsamo but the Germans were the target, and the U.S. declared war only in 1944. We didn't consider cutting the Murmansk railway thank to Western pressure. So in short, we were axis in the sense that we contributed to the effort, but we considered it our own war against the Soviets, which it kinda was if not put into the context of world war two
@subswithnovideoschalleng-zz2cz
@subswithnovideoschalleng-zz2cz 4 роки тому
Finland was german allie and germany send many thousand soldiers and many airplanes in contiunation war
@eggrollsoup
@eggrollsoup 4 роки тому
Sebastian Tiainen US declared war in 1941
@eggrollsoup
@eggrollsoup 4 роки тому
Sebastian Tiainen But you fought germans in lapland war because they felt betrayed that you made peace with soviets
@rogerpattube
@rogerpattube 4 роки тому
Axis
@jerrylee7737
@jerrylee7737 Рік тому
It's unfortunate when someone confuses historical facts. Germany's attack on the Soviet Union (Plan Barbarossa) began on 22 June 1941, not 1942 as you claim.
@ferblancart8669
@ferblancart8669 5 років тому
every video of yours breaks something i knew about WWII who would win: the established narrative of WWII, movies and pop culture ... or some TIK boy
@pepcozz8519
@pepcozz8519 5 років тому
Yep all history we know is wrong! this guy is right... only war didnt started in 1941 but 1939... great hunger in ukraine existed before germans attacked USSR... and was coused by Stalin. But hey trusting a dude in youtube over ppl that studied that topic for thier whole life is prob very smart...
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
The hunger you describe in the Ukraine happened a decade before the events in question. The war started in 1937 if you're Chinese or Japanese, and arguably earlier than that. And you're correct, people shouldn't be trusting some dude off the internet, which is why I encourage them to go out there and read books to verify or challenge my own conclusions. I encourage people to discuss and debate the issues brought up in the video, and spark an interest in the topic. I want to get people into history and have people educate themselves. I'm sorry if you dont agree with that view.
@thatjumpguy5890
@thatjumpguy5890 5 років тому
Not just debating the issue but also bringing up the epistemology used to attain the information. We all can tell our stories and speak in a tone that tells the others it's rooted in fact. Story telling is fun. I love lectures, especially when it comes to history. But to actually be critical is of your own information is a hard thing to do, and honestly, it's teeth grinding, because it is for me. It gets mucky. It becomes boring for the others. All that chaos to retain, and for what? To come out more confused than before? But the critical mind must be valued even if it comes with teeth grinding baggage.
@rodigoduterte9192
@rodigoduterte9192 5 років тому
Fer blancart WW2 is Overrate anyway, only the victor got a spotlight
@soulscanner66
@soulscanner66 5 років тому
Rodigo That's what Nazis say to jutify the Holocaust and atrocities against Slavs.
@blp5778
@blp5778 5 років тому
I don't get the drama over all this, really. Any standing army full of conscripts would have this order or something similar. I suppose the reason western people these days have a problem with it is due to our lack of understanding of what wartime necessities are. The past three or four US generations have grown up knowing nothing but voluntary military service - everyone in the military wants to be there. Those troops will on average not need such standing orders but in the face of such a serious invasion from an overwhelming force, you can firmly expect it would be instituted. Let us not deceive ourselves, however. Stalin''s willingness to let the people under his rule perish to protect his position and goals is well documented. Had the Soviet military leadership not been so thoroughly gutted by purges to ensure Stalin's power base and Stalin himself not so blindly ignored the coming German invasion, such loss of life as suffered by their people would not have been necessary. It is difficult to look on the eastern front of the war and not see "bad on bad" from a western perspective. Perhaps the worst outcome of all this overall would be if events were reversed and under different leadership, the Soviets had invaded Germany. Hitler would have fallen fairly quickly and Fascism as a political concept would not have been so thoroughly invalidated and could have taken hold elsewhere in Europe and grown into another monster again. Props to Tik here for pointing most of this out. He is absolutely correct in stating that this order did not in any way make the Red Army evil or unusual. He is also correct that it is other ways the regime handled itself that earn it the reputation it rightly deserves.
@elvirjade4742
@elvirjade4742 5 років тому
I feel like the kinds of you are dying breed in the West.
@alexbeau348
@alexbeau348 5 років тому
well - its easy to explain in few words - western propaganda. If look variety of films - its kinda Brad Pitt won nazis with the help of pvt Ryan
@BamaPewPew
@BamaPewPew 5 років тому
3 or 4 generations of voluntary military service? You forget about Vietnam brah?
@DeathYear2012
@DeathYear2012 5 років тому
@@BamaPewPew Probably looked over the fact these cats joined to get better food, but found the fact that it's still rations.
@DanRyzESPUK
@DanRyzESPUK 5 років тому
The Americans had a serious drop of morale in Vietnam, and when many officers turned "bloodthirsty", butchers and merciless towards their troops that many of them became target of "rogue" soldiers and many of them died in the front by "friendly fire". I heard the story that the commander that led the assault on the Burger hill became a target afterwards. American powers stopped with massive conscription after Vietnam. Who knows why?
@stephenbethell7548
@stephenbethell7548 5 років тому
Outstanding , thank you . From a Brit living in Russia .
@thewarlock539
@thewarlock539 3 роки тому
how is it there for you in Russia? just curious.
@82luft49
@82luft49 4 роки тому
There's nothing to think, you did a outstanding job of clarifying Order fora layman such as myself. I'm subscribing.
@82luft49
@82luft49 4 роки тому
Never write a comment when nursing a hangover. What I meant to say is " clarifying Order 227 for a layman such as myself."
@IrishTechnicalThinker
@IrishTechnicalThinker 5 років тому
Hollywood industry fails, yet again.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Yep, definitely
@lickspittle1
@lickspittle1 5 років тому
+Irish Technical Thinker Its a movie not a documentry
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
And, if it's going to make stuff up, it should be set in a fictional universe, not on a real historical event.
@lickspittle1
@lickspittle1 5 років тому
+TIK That would not leave many Hollywood war films, I don't expect historical accuracy from Hollywood. They are entertainment
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Fine by me. If they've not got the skill or capability to do it right, they shouldn't do it at all.
@horrido666
@horrido666 5 років тому
Ya, but shit rolls down hill. In all seriousness, I loved this video. One of your best. You are my fav youtube historian. Keep it up, and thank you.
@TheImperatorKnight
@TheImperatorKnight 5 років тому
Wow, thanks Dan! I'm glad you liked this one! Didn't expect anyone to say it's one of my best :D
@xmifi
@xmifi 5 років тому
And you love close combat series. What more can we expect from you :)
@soulscanner66
@soulscanner66 5 років тому
He's not a historian. He's just a guy talking to a camera.
@horrido666
@horrido666 5 років тому
I was using the term loosely, and it's perfectly acceptable usage. I'm not sure if you are a native English speaker.
@davidlatimer5034
@davidlatimer5034 Рік тому
There was another factor which plagued the Russian Army & it's discipline. Starlin's purges of the defence forces before WWII, removing offices whom his paranoia deemed as a threat to his reign & thus leaving less component offices in command.
@9090Glenn
@9090Glenn 5 років тому
this is so refreshing !!! great job !!!!
@charlestruby5094
@charlestruby5094 5 років тому
It’s about time, a UKposts video that was well researched with primary and secondary sources. Very well done. As a Social Studies teacher I learned something and am very proud to call you a colleague. No matter what our political beliefs, we need to keep our History true and correct.
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