Are you offering? 🤭

Super! 👍🏻

Short hands is a disability… and you know what they say about men with small hands… 😉 Also if you need 36T for climbing… you need an MTB. Not a Road bike. 😎

Spot on sir. Probably the writer cannot afford di2.

The thing I like best about electronic is that I'm less likely to make shifting mistakes when my brain is fried and it won't get out of adjustment on a ride. I also like the fact that it shows gear use. I've used it to reevaluate my setup.

@@reginaldscot165 there are pros that use larger cassettes. Why grind up a 20% grade in a 28 when you can spin up in a 36?

@@DaveCM why would you ride a 20% hill anyway?

Only, it’s heavier, more expensive, needs to be charged, doesn’t make you faster…. And so on and so on. But apart from all that, it’s the best upgrade. Well, if you don’t consider literally everything else on the bike. Personally folks I’d no take this advice, there are plenty of better upgrades to make before getting Di2 and it’s difficult to even consider Di2 as an upgrade.

@@reginaldscot165 I guess you haven't used the electronical shifting in hilly environments? You're definitely much faster with electronical shifting going up and down. I have used mechanical shifting over 30 years and would never return to mechanical shifting for this reason.

@@reginaldscot165 There are many of us who love the elegance and performance without being driven by 'is it faster'. Many cyclists are enthusiasts for fitness, fun, endurance and social connection while enjoying road biking. That's me. I LOVE my Ultegra 12 speed Di2.

How many times have you skipped a ride because you forgot to charge your battery? How many times have you taken it to the shop for reprogramming because it wasn't working properly? I have two riding buddies with Di2, and I've seen these failures multiple times. How many times has it stuck in top gear on a ride, as we've seen happen on Froome's, Almeida's, and many other pros' professionally maintained bikes? I've been riding the same mechanical shifting for 22 years on 3 different frames (now 'retired' on my rain bike), still works perfectly every day, every ride, every time, having only replaced the rear derailleur because of a crash (Campy Record 10 new in 2001). I will never buy a battery operated group, just so I don't have to charge it. They're perfectly good when they're working, but there's simply no functional advantage over top-tier mechanical shifting, and they're less reliable, more expensive to buy and maintain, and heavier. Period.

​@@reginaldscot165 first and only video I have seen. Yea, di2 is more expensive at the moment. if you like your old mechanic and don't want a change, I can understand you don't like it. But please, you are just alienating yourself from your youtube audience if you belittle the people who like it. I didn't watch to the end so if you said anything useful that would contradict that impression, that's why. I have both mechanical and di2 ultegra, and nobody is going to tell me that di2 sucks in comparison. Because I have zero issues with it, and if it was cheaper I'd replace the mechanical one with another set. But then again, prices will go down in time.

The other day I got on my bike (sram group set) set off, shifted the FD and it moved up to the Big ring without a sound… and I was like 🤤 I guess it depends on who built your bike? 🙂

No, it depends on how much time has passed from the last service 😉

Maybe wrong frame and wrong group set rather than need Di2 then? 😁 yes I have the same feeling about the number of batteries I need to charge already! Woke up for a ride this morning and my computer is flat because I forgot to charge… but at least my gears still work! 😂

Thank you for the info 👍🏻

That's where you can upgrade just the FD or just the shifters and still save some money. In MTB groupsets, I'd say Deore 12s is all you need with hte addition of XT shifters.

I love a good triple chainring. ❤️ sounds like a wonderful bike. 😍

I have a old aluminuym Giant with triple ring, was very happy to go to a compact set in the front with a used 10 year old carbon de rosa. @@reginaldscot165

Yes but unfortunately I’m in a minority 😢

You have to overhaul your cables once a year??? I have lived in wet and cold UK and in hot and Humid Asia and I think I’ve only needed to replace my cables because of rust 1 time… in 20 years. The other times I changed them because of upgrades or improvements. But I wax my cables before they go in so maybe that’s why? Try waxing your cables. 🙂 Safe riding!

If one is using dura ace cable, it won’t last that long with that “coating” they have on it. Starts peeling off by just looking at it the wrong way.

I replace cables for customers all the time. Sometimes they break in the shifters and are a pain to dig out. I am talking about cables in bikes with a year of use 5000 miles.

SRAM has much better cable routing than Shitmano which will bugger up gear cables really fast in comparison.

That sounds almost as good as you can get! Rim 👍🏻 Not an SL7 👍🏻 Hypers 👍🏻 Mechanical Group set 👍🏻 Winning! 👏🏻

I have one bike with electronic and the other mechanical. The only time I miss electronic is on the rare occasions I have new cables and they stretch while on a ride. The second is when I'm completely bonked and mechanical just takes more thought process. (I will occasionally under or over throw shifts when I'm spent.) Electronic shifts faster, but I never saw that as a problem. But, I'm not racing in a crit either.

@@DaveCM Funny thing is, with the right cables and proper tuning, mechanical can actual shift faster....at least until the cables stretch a bit of course.

@@DaveCM You can actually pre-stretch new cables when you install them, this is what I do now. Just install them like usual (don't cut to size yet), actuate the shifter multiple times while holding the derailleur (there'll be cable slack when you're done if there was no slack upon initial installation), undo the cable clamp, redo it, index and cut to size.

i have the same setup. go Di2.

It sounds like you didn’t have a good bike mechanic. My Shimano Ultegra and my SRAM Red mechanical shift without issue flawlessly. If I have any issues a small adjustment that takes about 10 seconds normally fixes it. I can see that for people who don’t have a good mechanic or don’t understand how cable shifting works might find Di2 more foolproof? But then again if they don’t have a good mechanic Di2 might be set up wrong in the first place? 🤔

New cables settle in, so adjustments are needed when first installed. Also, the tolerances in the shift lever are super tight, so if they are off my just a little, a given gear can have the derailleur move too much or too little. In that case, no setting (or expert mechanic) can adjust it to be perfectly linear. Electric shifting at the derailleur, rather than at the lever can be much more reliably accurate. There’s no drift and no non-linearity. It’s simply a superior experience for me. I had no idea how much I dislike noisy gears. The lack of noise and reliability of the shifts on Di2 has been a much superior experience for me.

great points Jon!

And virtually meaningless if you’re concerned about actual performance gains and cost vs benefits gained.

@@Mottleydude1 A good shift vs a missed shift at a crucial moment in a race can be a significant performance gain. Having the chain lined up well in every gear is a performance gain. Whether it’s worth it or not depends on finances. I have one electronic and two mechanical. I prefer electronic, but haven’t wanted to spend the cash on my winter and XC bikes.

Excellent!

It’s a very insignificant advantage for all the disadvantages in my opinion and it’s only going to get worse. Make your bike dependent on electronics and they will have you by the balls in the future. Updates, tracking, obsolescence, mandatory service, subscription! No thanks!

Excellent comment and yes the di2 is not compatible with any other version. So if parts run out you have a very expensive paperweight. And that’s just what they want… people like me who ride 15 year old group sets are hated by the cycling industry. With electric gearing they can have the lifetime of the product much shorter. It will be like people who “upgrade” their phones every year.

If you want an "affordable hobby", why do you own a dozen bikes?

Because 9 of them cost next to nothing and I've been cycling for 50 years.

Yes, people will buy electronic if they don’t get a choice and they are pumped full of false promises and marketing. And the rest of the freedom loving free thinking individuals will suffer.

I would imagine you would need to replace any rubber seals after? But how it would effect the warranty I don’t know?

Or… get SRAM FORCE or RED 22 for the same price or less. No trim function. Shifts fine. Looks better. I don’t remember the last time i “needed” to change a gear cable. Adjusted infrequently. Easy to fix and get parts for and no special tools or software required. Will make your bike super light.

@@reginaldscot165 Have you noticed more problems with SRAM front derailleur than shimano in the mechanical variant? Force front derailleur with red 22 shifters seems to frequently not want to shift up into big chain ring when over 350w (and yes I lower power in the instant to attempt to get a smooth shift). Yes, the YAW is set properly. Never had this issue with 105 front d.

105 mechanical is lighter than Di2, plus 105 di2 is disc brake only- darn near impossible to achieve, if at all, even if you were investing Dura Ace level money. 105 di2 bikes weigh as much as many Sora level bikes.

@@terbennett Giant claim weight of 7.8 on new TCR 105 di2 and 8.4 on new Propel advanced with Sram rival. Not bad if correct.

Sram Rival AXS bikes weigh in the Shimano Sora range fir a comparable frameset. Amazing how people are willing to drop boatloads of cash on a boat anchor of a bike with constantly noisy and unneeded disc brakes, and often inaccessible internal cabling simply for electronic shifting and disc brakes that in 99% of road or gravel riding is completely unnecessary.. 😀

Yeah, the cables don’t really bother me because I ride traditional looking bikes. But I totally agree, unless your bike is so modern you literally can’t fit cables, then Di2 12 is simply unnecessary cost wise.

@@reginaldscot165 I'm pretty sure that bad cable guiding is not modern, since there are plenty of precedence for that earlier. Just call it what it is: retarded design.

Great! More battery waste and a bright future of paying for software updates for group sets! All for? Slightly better shifting? (Depending on how good your mechanic is?)

That’s about the only benefit I can see.

Interesting comment, I don’t really agree or count any of this as a tangible benefit, however even if they were for me it would come back to my original points… that being: The vastly increased cost doesn’t justify the small benefit. (If any) The danger of being trapped into technology where the manufacturer has you by the balls forever is not worth the benefits. The technology is heavier and less aerodynamic than older technology and thus there is no race advantage in reality of having slightly faster shifting? (Slightly being tenths of a second) But I enjoyed reading your comment anyway and thank you for your input. 🙂🙏🏻

@@reginaldscot165 the question if these advantages are "worth the money" is subjective, thats what I meant with you might not consider those relevant. It is not relevant saving 5g on a titanium bolt (and paying EUR 5 for it) for a lot of people either. But I can still see the point in doing it, even if you will most likely never actually realize the benefit. About the weigtht penalty of the DI2 I don't think it actually exists though. The 12 SPD DI2 is 20g heavier according to data I found, that is correct, but when you compare the 11 spd variants the DI2 is even lighter so boils down to 12 speed being heavier than 11 speed, due to one cog more on the cassette. So if you dont want/need 12 speed, fair point, you can save the weight. but if there would ever be a 12 spd mechanical, it will probably not be any lighter. BTW. another advantage of the DI2- you can make the RD cage smaller as you dont ever need the ability to use "small-small" (I an not sure about the Ultegra but the XT does actually only come in "GS" instead of SGS) and so you additionally have a shorter chain, which again is advantageous. Those might all be small advantages but this is how technological evolution works, incrementally step by step, you cant deny it. Not everything is relevant or interesting for everyone or by far not worth the money for everyone - but eventually you don't want the old technology from 30year ago anymore. You would not run a bike with downtube shifters either today. At least not compitetively or as a daily driver, stating it is a nice ride experience.

Thank you 🙏🏻 I really appreciate that. 🙂👍🏻

Very lucky indeed! All the best! ❤️

Good luck running as long as you did your 10 speed. 🙂👍🏻

42mm tyres? I have never seen an MTB with Ultegra before! 😉

@reginaldscot165 It seems that I'm defying the categories. Randonneur is still the best fitting category but there are no production randonneur bikes anyways. So I'm stuck with a custom bike from a constructeur or a custom build from a frameset by myself. Since I was a roadie before I still use road components.

Much appreciated! Yes it does seem to have lost the idea of what cycling should be? Simple and reliable?

I disagree with most points ... I am not a pro and don't do races: - Dura Ace old and new is a no-go for me, because they don't have 11-34 cassette and because I am not the youngest anymore, also like riding in the mountains and do long trips of 100-200km, 11-34 is my minimum requirement. - 12 vs 11 speed: I don't need one more gear, agree, but the 12s 11-34 cassette has a much better distribution of the gears. Most cassettes try to have a linear (like 10%) step between gears but as power squares with speed a somewhat exponential distribution is much better. Range is the same, but old 11-34 highest gears were 11-13-15-17... and new 11-12-13-14-15. So new cassette has narrower steps on the heavier gears and bigger jumps on the lower gears which I consider as much, much better. Also the Campagnolo Ekar has got this nice non-linear distribution. At least for non-pros I would argue that this is the much more suitable setup. - Mechanical Dura Ace is almost impossible to get in Germany and neither can you buy new bikes with old Dura Ace. So suggesting getting the old Dura Ace over new Ultegra is already difficult to do. Also consider spare parts in the future when it will become more and more difficult to get parts for older group sets than for newer group sets ... of course depends on how long you keep your bike but if you are arguing with price then I assume you keep your bikes for at least 10 years and spare parts do become an issue then. - Ultegra DI2 has the buttons in the hoods to switch pages and operate your bike computer, the 105 DI2 hasn't. That feature alone I enjoy a lot. - Electronic shifting: I heard this before that people assume maintenance with electronic shifting would be more difficult. But the point is with electronic shifting you don't need maintenance, there is not readjusting necessary and if it is, it is a matter of seconds to adjust it. Also seeing in which gear I am is an advantage to me and the synced shifting is a very nice feature as well. And it is much safer and quicker to look on the computer than looking down on your cassette to figure out in which gear I am. In general riding my bike is for fun and a hobby. And I believe that people will ride more bike the more fun they have with their bike. For some people it might just be the color of their bike that motivates them, for some it is the look of carbon wheels, and electronic shifting is just another fun factor in my opinion. So if I would buy a new bike today I wouldn't want anything else than the Shimano Ultegra DI2 12-speed, it is the perfect fun-factor for me.

Good and interesting comment. Thank you. 🙂👍🏻

Yes it’s a great choice! The 105 crank doesn’t have the same design at the Ultegra or Dura-ace so it won’t split. 🙂👍🏻

Couldn’t agree more for most day to day rides and I even some racing. The nice thing about Low end stuff is it just seems to need less maintenance and just keeps going. I have an 8 speed Sora and it’s been chugging away for years.

Good Observations. Thank you for your interesting comment. 🙏🏻🙂

Rival or 105 are excellent. For Rival you can even get 1X set up. And Some Chinese group set’s are not half bad to be honest. Not 100% sure on RD cage options.

Great comment! Reminds me of a song: “Will you still need me, will you still feed me When I'm sixty-four…” Sorry, I’m a big The Beatles fan. So basically you are the right Democratic for Di2 in my opinion, you are benefiting from the extra help on the gears and having some bigger gears helps you up the hills. 🙂👍🏻 Happy cycling. 🙏🏻

@@reginaldscot165 Do you mean Demographic? 😂

Super! A great comment. Thank you.

That was a few years ago. 🙂

@@reginaldscot165l am curious , do you think 12 cogs doesn't contribute to noise, chain wear and reduced smoothness in the drivetrain?

My good quality DT Swiss aluminium wheels are heavier and more expensive than my Winspace carbon wheels… di2 is about $2000 more expensive than my mechanical group set. There is a big difference. Also, carbon wheels have advantages in weight and aerodynamics. Di2 is heavier and less aero than what I currently have. 🙃

You sound like the kind of person we need more of in the world to be honest. 😅

Wow, respect! Not to mention you're one step closer to casting aluminium, maybe... Good luck! ; )

Specialized's Tarmac SL7 is one of the few bikes with integrated internal routing that can take any mechanical groupset, not just Shimano's top three.

Very little personal experience as a owner of a E-group but plenty of testing and riding other peoples stuff as part of my work. Shifting is better. But how much better? Someone said it’s faster, but what are we talking about? 10th of a second? Enough to justify the price? I personally think not. Also it’s taking control away from the user, like the Di2 won’t let you cross-chain? Unless you mess with the settings, but what a pain if you have to keep plugging it in to a laptop to get the gears to do what you want. I find my mechanical group sets shift beautifully, but maybe because I’m a bike mechanic and very OCD. Ha ha It’s true that the cables need adjustment infrequently, but that’s normally 1/4 turn of a barrel adjuster. Is it any more hassle than having to charge your bike with a long tangled wire? If you are doing long distance you would carry an extra set of cables. I have met some cyclists who ride across the world and they do just that. You can’t do the same with Di2. Unless you carry a new RD and laptop. 🤭 Gearing? My 8 speed gravel bike has a triple chain ring 50/39/30 and my cassette has 11-30. I can climb up walls with that. 🤭 on the flat I keep up with the road bikes and on the gravel hills I pass the MTB riders. 😎 when it comes to 11 Vs 12 it’s only 1 gear. It’s not the world of difference. Aerodynamics. When I look at the data available the drag loss on cables is about 2 watts. I’m sure the drag on the e-setup is similar to only 2 watts. You might find your rim brake climbing bike is more aero than your disc aero bike. Let me explain. I was looking at data for a disc Giant TCR (climbing bike) Vs the new disc TREK Mad-One. (Same wheels) At 40kph the difference in watts was only 6 in favour of the Mad-one. Now we know for a fact that rim brakes are more aero than disc because they sit in the dirty air. According to more data I have read rim is anywhere from 3 to 5 watts faster than Disc as a result. Not only that but the rim bikes often used narrower tyres and they are also provably faster and more aero. So this brings me to your belief that your new disc bike is faster… I bet you it’s not. (With the same size and brand of wheels for example) How do I know? Simple, firstly all the data I have just shown. Secondly, your new bike is heavier, basic physics dictates that a heavier object will require more work in order to get from rest to a velocity. So in simple terms your heavier bike can’t possibly be “faster” in terms of Acceleration. So it will come second in a sprint. Also, we know that heavier bikes are harder and slower on the climb, you will simply use more energy to push a heavier object up a hill. When things get hilly your new bike will also come second. Finally if you look at the TDF, when 90% of the peloton was using disc aero bikes and only a few riders were sticking to rim… who kept winning all the grand tours? That’s right, first, second and often 3rd place went to a guy on a rim brake climbing bike. Now those teams are also on disc they lost their dominance. A lot of this “my new disc aero bike is faster” stuff I hear from people is just in their heads. Just like this Idea that e-groups are worth it. It’s marketing. Another reason Di2 is a bad idea I forgot to mention. Remember the pandemic, government crackdown on civil liberties? Now all cars are digital they can just switch them off and stop you traveling for whatever reason they want… make your bike reliant on the same technology and the moment they want to or when say the power goes out you can say goodbye to riding your new bike. Mechanical is freedom. ✊🏻😅 Great comment! Safe riding to you!

​@@reginaldscot165 Hey good response, 👍 but I do have to disagree with certain statements. 😁 You should definitely put an electronic groupset on your bike and test it out, at least for a couple thousand kilometers. I do agree that the shifting benefits of Di2 might not be big enough to justify the price for someone, but I would still prefer electronic over mechanical shifting (the thing I love to most is the limit setings on the FD and automatic adjustments to the gear on RD). Shifting speed? It is slightly faster, but dont really care about that much... It is true, that you need another device to change the initial settings (if you are OK with factory settings, you don't need anything), but you might just use one everyone has in a pocket. It is called mobilephone. With riding across the world, I would probably also stick with the mechanical groupset. 🙂 But with any race sub 1000 miles, I would go with electronic all the way... (On 24 hour races You would like triple chainring on your road bike? What about the weight penalty of the 3x chainset 😁 I do prefer 1x setup on gravel and CX. Not that good regarding the gearing spacing, but way lighter, easier for cleaning after race/ride etc... The drag of cables is roughly 1,5-4W (Canyon stated that it was 3W in their study). As far as I'm concerned, that is not much, but it is way more than if you compare just the electronic and mechanical FD and RD (If I just calculate from cross section area you would be lower than 0,4W, not mentioning the "dirty" air around RD/FD). I would not mention it at all, since it is quite insignificant, but you stated, that the mechanical groupset is more efficent aerodynamicly, which is just not the case in real world. Generally speaking disc brakes on road bikes are by itself less aero than rim brakes. No arguing about that. But disc brakes allow you to better shape rims and frames, which can easily balance that in favor of disc brake bikes. Not even talking about the major thing, which is better braking performance ---> faster downhills, more control in cornering etc. (Tell Matej Mohoric, that is not true) 😂 Lighter bikes are faster. Right, but how much? For rider like me on a 10km 6% climb (riding on an FTP power) it is calculated diffrence of roughly 4-5 seconds compared with the absolutly same scenario with just 300g hevier bike (bit less when I was in top shape). If I don't take in the account any other possible benefits of modern bike I can do more than this difference in the downhill... Also with disc brakes I don't have to change my rims every couple of seasons, because they are grinded through. I also do agree, that if you are elite climber, or racing hill climbing TTs etc., you should go with rim brakes. But most stages during 2022 season on TFD, Vuelta, Giro, all the spring classics, WC etc. were won with disc brake bikes. That is just a fact. With all the parts shortage, it is difficult to maintain anything. Guess it is easier in big markets like here in Europe, but still problematic. The fun thing that the biggest problem I had during pandemic to get parts for my old 3*9 fully mechanical MTB, but that is just bad luck I guess.... All the best! 🙂

Electronic's groups are heavy expensive elitist and absolutly non convivial, not exactly what à bike is supposer to be.I totale agrée with Reginald!

@@jean-paullanglois5452I think shifting in general is elitist 😂 Hope you are running singlespeed 😂 BTW 105 Di2 or Rival AXS are cheaper than several mechanical groupsets…

@@marekvag running chorus 10 speed.

Maintain as in keep it running. For example: if you damage your RD not only will it be harder to get a new one, but you can’t just take parts from another one to fix yours because it’s coded! Also with a normal mechanical RD it’s cross compatible with any other 11 speed shimano RD. But if you have Di2 Ultegra it’s only compatible with its own model and gen of that group set. So if that group set is out of production you are totally screwed.

@@reginaldscot165 not to be pedantic but that's technically "harder to repair yourself". If you plan to keep a group set for a decade I wouldn't buy Di2 personally, but even then you can still get Di2 6800 parts if you look around and that was released in 2014. You can now get 7kg retail bikes with Ultegra Di2, weight aspect pretty much a non-issue for most people. If you are buying a standalone groupset, is it sensible to then buy Ultegra Di2 over 105 Di2 in 2023? Not really. I have 2 bikes with Di2 and can't say I've had any issues at all. The cost is too high, but you could just say that and be done with it. Wouldn't make a good video though.

Then you haven’t tried my Ultegra 6600.

@@reginaldscot165 I’ve been riding for two decades, worked at a bike shop as a mechanic and group ride leader for a decade, crit raced for a few years. I’ve ridden everything under the sun and there’s no denying that technology has massively improved over the years. Any disconnect from that reality is just delusion.

Great 👍🏻

You haven’t really explained why it’s the “best choice for you” other than “you dreamed about it” and “you wanted it.” But if you are happy then I good for you and I hope you enjoy it. 👍🏻 All the best!

@@reginaldscot165 I think you are looking for complexity when it is not there. This nice chap just wants the latest toy on one of his bikes. Simple. Its a treat that he can afford. I respect that. I cannot even afford a Civic Type R so my aspirations are a Cinelli Dynamo handlebars that will give more usability to me. As for missing more explanation well its probably understood that he has faith that it will be the bee's knees! Remember Reginald that anytime there is something new out, everyone only hears good things and only later will any complaints come. Verdict still out there

Good point, my retort might be if you save a “second” because you have Di2… how many seconds are lost Vs mechanical because you have Di2? Aerodynamics/weight? 🙂

@Reginald Scot Di2 is marginally more aero.

@Reginald Scot di2 is marginally more aero. Weight wise that is more of a disc thing than DI2 as with the 11spd there was little difference between Ultegra Mechanical & Ultegra DI2 or Dura-ace DI2 & Mechanical Dura-ace. Think Ultegra was something like 80g difference. I agree though that the extra tech isn't great on the ratio of cost vs Weight vs performance. The performance benefits of discs & di2 arent large enough incomparison to the cost increases. A few years ago you could buy a new bike under the UCI weight limit for probably about a 3rd of the modern equivalent bike that is likely well over the UCI limit. Look at Trek Emonda's the 2nd tier frame it weights more than my old base level version 1 Scott Foil 30 & the Emonda is a climbing bike.

I’m glad I could save you money and hassle further down the road. 🙏🏻🙂

Danny, the defy is great with Di2 though.. It's epic!!!!

Any reason why nobody mentions Campagnolo? As far as I can see still offer mechanical and rim up to super record. Campag now very affordable vs Shimano. I’m biased but I think they’re over looked because Shimano control so many UKposts channels amongst other things.

Yes we are not being given the choice.

It’s a valid argument, how much difference it makes is up for debate?

I’m sorry I don’t speak MTB. It’s all totally over my head. 🤭 Thanks for the comment anyway. 🙏🏻 Safe riding.

Yup. 👍🏻

Cool 😎 👍🏻

Yes please should never follow the Pros because they are paid to use that stuff. It’s on my list of videos to make. 🤭

For non-racers I completely agree though.

SRAM red mechanical is index free and doesn’t limit what chainring/cassette combo I use unlike Di2. I will concede having more shifts with Di2 is of benefit, but you need to pay even more for that and does that small bonus outweigh the obvious performance/other drawbacks? That would be my question.

I see you have someone playing golf as your thumbnail? That’s all I need to know. 🤭 The reason pros use anything is because they are paid to use it by companies that sponsor them for millions of dollars to promote their products. It has literally nothing to do with how good the product is. It’s obvious to anyone who doesn’t take everything at face value.

@@reginaldscot165 Hi Reg, be careful on comments regarding other sports. I am an avid racer of bikes love a good crit. And can tell you if your not riding electric in a crit you are doomed. The fast and accurate shifting with electric changes when and how you shift EG while sprinting. Some of the best athletes on the planet ride bikes for exercise.

I like SRAM also, but still the mechanical. I use to ride in the UK in sub zero temperatures, sometimes in 2 sets of gloves! Must admit it can be tricky but with practice it’s no problem. Running a battery at that temperature is not good for them, they won’t hold charge well and you will significantly shorten the life. But if you can afford to replace them then it’s no issue. 🙂👍🏻 Safe riding! 🙏🏻

Yes it also seems crazy to me as well! Here where I live we don’t even have winter? But cyclists are buying disc bikes? I ask: “do you ride in the rain?” They say “no, if it’s raining I go on zwift.” So I say “why do you want disc brakes then?” And they reply. “Because everyone is buying disc bikes now…” There are very few people who are capable of independent though nowadays. 😅

Disc brake are superior in the winter. Why would you put it away?

Yes, the loss of choice and control… welcome to life in 2023…

The watch analogy is an excellent one. 👍🏻 Just like carbon frames, the cycling industry has found a way to sell a cheaply made product at a much higher price. Fantastic comment. 👍🏻

Thanks for the comment. 🙂 As I have mentioned if you are disabled (arthritis is included in that) then Di2 makes sense. But Ultegra for the price is just a poor choice no matter how you look at it. I feel sorry for the people that made that choice but hopefully being harsh will prevent more people from making the same mistake. The dangers of Di2 for the future of cycling and humanity are real in my opinion. You will probably stop cycling when it happens but the next generations are going to be condemned to some terrible hardships as a result of choosing electronic gears. At 62 I’d have spent that considerable money on a custom Ti bike or at the very least a steel frame. TREK bikes are notoriously heavy even in carbon and as I get older (I am 38) I see the value In better ride quality. The other nice thing about Ti and steel is the bike I have now I will hopefully be still riding when I’m 62. 😉 Just a different perspective for you. Thank you for watching and safe riding. 👍🏻❤️

It’s not more reliable than mechanical. Yes you need to adjust it less. But when things get extreme or time passes by… electronic fails. And I can’t possibly think how it can make cycling more fun? Some of the most fun on a bike I’ve had is on an old 8 speed sora bike I have that doesn’t even shift well. 🤷🏻‍♂️😁

I couldn’t agree more 👍🏻

Yes that’s the smart move. 👍🏻 Thanks for your comment!

My first modern carbon bike from2012,had ultegra di2 10spd,and after down tube shifters it was sheer bliss,lightening fast and reliable.So my second bike had to have di2,but in the meantime 11spd came along so it had ultegra5800 di2,which performed flawlessly,till one day the RD servo motor overpowered the inner stopscrew and drove the chain into the spokes. I HAD JUST ARRIVED AT WORK AND PUT IT IN THE LOWEST GEAR TO MOVE OFF EASILY WHEN GOING BACK HOME AND JUST MANAGED TO PUT MY FOOT DOWN.SHIMANO MUST HAVE KNOWN ABOUT THIS ISSUE,BECAUSE THEY REDESIGNED THE 8000s RD stopscrew.

That’s very true, yes 105 is awesome!

Ha ha I’m not even sure he can read!

For the company, yeah. “It’s A Great way to extract more money from gullible people. 😘

@@reginaldscot165 Gullible?

Excellent 👍🏻

I’m guessing you bought it. 😂 Big difference between “nice things” and “expensive stupid things.”

@@reginaldscot165 As I said, I have 105 mechanical 😊

I guess it depends on the kind of cycling you do and personal experience. Personally I’ve never had a problem with only 10 gears. 🤭

I don’t remember saying that is the only reason people buy Di2? (Thanks for the complement by the way, I’m nearly 40) I think sometimes people have different perspective on priorities (that doesn’t make their perspective correct) and sometimes people are badly informed and sometimes, people are just a bit stupid and easy to mislead with marketing. But I don’t worry about older people as I imagine most of them are smart and wise enough not to buy Di2. It’s more a warning to the younger people with less money that they shouldn’t invest in this nonsense. 🙂

​@@reginaldscot165 You have the thoughtfulness of someone half your age! :-) (and still quite young to me) Your narrative is hyper-simplistic and you casually dismiss facts and experiences of other riders throughout these comments without really backing up your assertions. You also seem to miss another reason for more cogs, which is increasing the gear ratio range. (SRAM does this better, IMO)

Humm, I have 4 mechanical bikes and I spend almost no time adjusting gears. Perhaps it has to do with me being a good mechanic and knowing how to set them up in the first place. And if they do need adjustment it normally only takes a half turn of the barrel adjuster… something I can do when washing the bike, a job I do every week anyway. So for me I don’t see this as being a valid argument. But I will admit you are technically correct, I do lose maybe 1 to 2 minutes per year adjusting my gears.

The markup must be massive!

bingo, you nailed it. cheaper to manufacture and higher price point. smaller supply chain. and we the consumer suffer the consequences

I disagree. 🙂

@@reginaldscot165 That's totally cool! 😎

Excellent points. Yes many “adults” today seem to act like children in their spending habits… they were clearly raised by TV advertisements rather than responsible parents. 🤔

In what respect? 🙂

@@reginaldscot165 when shifting under pressure it's easier and more efficient. When on a technical climb or descent mechanical doesn't always react to your demand when di2 does. I have two mechanical groupsets and they are great but they still do not perform as well as Di2. It's a luxury to have as any groupset that works is good enough, Di2 is just a bonus.

Is it heavier or lighter than rim brake mechanical? To get as light as rim mechanical do you need to spend more or less money? I rest my case. 😝

That is not what I commented on or disagree to. I also have a bike with mechanical shifting, and I see a lot of advantages with that. But weight is not an advantage/disadvantage being a rider at a mediocre level at most will ever notice. My point was simply that a bike with electronic shifting and disc brakes doesn’t necessarily need to be heavy, and certainly not 9-10 kg. My bike with mechanical shifting is the one I use the most, and I am very satisfied with it, but I prefer electronic. Have never experienced any problems like running out of battery power or any other issue, and until then I will most likely prefer electronic shifting. Rim brakes on the other hand I will never, ever consider, but that is a totally different “discussion”. Really like your videos and and find them very informative. Keep up the good work.

Maybe it’s smooth, but at what cost. You are also comparing a mid range group with a high end group… and if you set up a shimano mechanical group well their is nothing smoother… (professional opinion only.)

Wonderful! 🙂

Good to hear 🙂

True, if everyone had my opinion the bike industry wouldn’t be able to sell this over priced stuff and make lost more money. 🙂

Excellent comment, I’m sure you are not Dumb, I just use this language for dramatic effect. 😘 Safe riding and all the best. 👍🏻

You could get to your 11T faster with fewer cogs because it was Shimano. Campag mechanical (at least Record and Super Record) lets you upshift up to 5 cogs with one stroke, and 3 down - much faster than any Shimano mechanical or electronic system. Huge advantage for sprinting or covering an attack in racing, not so much for casual riding, where one push per cog may actually be preferred.

@@carlmons I prefer SRAM RED to shimano shifting, but now I'm on the lookout for Campy Record/Super Record mech grouppo 11 speed.

What about an electric bike? 🤭

I don’t dislike anything because it’s new, I just did a video talking about the very new technology of TPU inner tubes. They are fantastic! Best cycling product made in my lifetime. But, they have many advantages for a very low price. Di2 have lots of disadvantages for a totally idiotic price. 😂 A lot of people accuse me of being anti-technology. (despite the fact I used to work in robotics!) but it’s just an insult used by people that feel offended by the fact i just pointed out they wasted their money. (People don’t like to hear the truth… it really upsets them.) They got hoodwinked by the marketing department of Shimano and they want everyone else to fall for the same trap so they don’t feel stupid. 🫣 Thank you for your comment! Safe riding! 🙏🏻

@@reginaldscot165 yes i´ve seen it and it was great advice!

Excellent 👍🏻

Great comment. 👍🏻🙂

@@reginaldscot165 Sorry the edit is meant to say "Rim brake electronic". Got the Red eTap AXS rim brake conversion kit. Still cheaper than buying a new disc brake bike.

Like I say, if you are disabled then Di2 is a good option. 👍🏻

A well set up mechanical groupset won't be that problematic. One of my customers' bike is on Ultegra R8020 and the only problem the groupset had was a non-responsive rear derailleur because the cable nipple dislodged from the cradle inside the STI lever. This won't happen if the cable was clamped without any cable slack, which wasn't the case when his friend (also my customer) re-clamped it. Mine never had any problems because one, only I worked on it and two, I set it up right.

👍🏻👌🏻

You can get parts online that will fit your 5800. So if you want a LC derailleur and a bigger cassette it’s totally possible. 🙂👍🏻

And how much faster is the shift done from top to bottom? 10th of a second? More? Have you tested it yourself and other riders? How often in a ride do you go from 28 to 11 or the other way? Is that the only advantage? Will that justify the cost? Just asking questions. 🙂 Also Campy group sets can drop the entire cassette in a single lever press if I remember correctly? You can still buy the 11 speed group sets I mentioned and some 10 speed stuff is still floating around. I don’t say people should actively look for it, but if you have it or get it it’s not a bad option. Yes the industry sucks. But their is a difference between the flashy group set of the past and of today. One was actually quite fantastic and the other is a joke played of people who A) are easily fooled by marketing or B) have more money than they know what to do with. IMO. 😘 Great comment! Safe riding!

Ok 🙂

No you don’t “have to” there will be other options, maybe Chinese? Maybe better? And probably cheaper! 🤭

If you buy Shimano Di2 then you don’t have cables, but you do have wires that need running through the frame… and it’s all fun and games until something goes wrong and your bike will be back in the shop even longer and more expensive than your cables. Also the issue might be your bike choice, if the frame is that bad then try a more traditional frame. 🙂👍🏻

Yikes! Some serious technical problems. Hope you get it all sorted out. Or get something that works for you. 🙂👍🏻

Thanks man, I truly appreciate it! Don’t forget to click the bell 🔔 😘

Oh please do, I think there will always be demand for good quality mechanical stuff! ❤️

Sounds fine to me. 🙂👍🏻 All the best and safe riding!

Fantastic 👍🏻

“Looks like my work here is done, up up and away!” 😎

That’s fantastic. 🙂👍🏻

If you want automatic shifting on your bike why do you even want to ride a bike? Why reduce the elements that are required to ride a bike? More technology isn’t always “better.” You might as well say: “why do Japanese people still make swords in the traditional way, why not just get robots to make them in a factory?” That’s What a soulless individual would say, someone who just doesn’t get it… If that’s your attitude why not just get rid of the middle man and go drive a car. I mean you want to take the human out of the sport by the look of it.

Glad I made you laugh 😁👍🏻

Great 👍🏻