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"Dr Peterson, what's your favorite color?" "Well that depends what you mean by favorite, and it also depends what you mean by color. This is also a very complex question. One must acknowledge the underlying verisimilitude that is irrevocably nested within a multi-layered metaphysical substrate, which many people fundamentally conflate with their ideological presuppositions with no uncertain irregularity, causing the inadvertent dismissal of Jung's archetypal extrapolation of the quintessential axiomatic juxtaposition required to achieve Raskolnikov's magnitude of neo-Marxist existential nihilism..."

This seems to be roughly the 5 millionth time Pangburn has posted some variant of this clip.

Audience capture happened. Daily Wire happened.

What's all this about religion? You only have to look at the jackets Jordan wears these days to see things aren't right. On a serious note, I felt rather grubby listening to this conversation. It was a bit like being at a dinner party when one of the guests leaves the room and the other diners start talking about him. These guests here, of course, were being paid to talk publicly. Their smugness was toe curling.

Peterson hasn't really changed. There's this weird insistence that he went crazy or something online but no, he just had some rough years and is now out of those. That's it. Listen to his newer videos, they're the same stuff he's been talking about for years except he's added more things to his knowledge. I don't get why people are so put-off by him lately, he's literally still Jordan Peterson but slightly older now than he was a few years ago. That's it.

" Truth to me, is what comports with reality,done, at least that's the truth I care about", that serves well for me as well.

Jordan suffered from relevance syndrome just like everyone on social media who rocketed stardom and then tried to expand into areas he had no expertise in. The more he looked weak in certain areas the more stress he placed upon himself and hence the breakdown. He's only human just like every other person who enjoys the fame and failure in life.

As social creatures we are hard-wired to feel empathy, and are inclined towards altruism and compassion. That is the foundation of moral-ethical thinking and development. Nothing supernatural or metaphysical needed. To not feel empathy is a significant pathology-- a sociopath. The whole "Original Sin/we are ontologically inclined towards the bad" becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. And frankly, it seems like a type of child abuse to raise one thinking that of themselves. If you only don't murder or steal because you're afraid of eternal punishment you're not actually a good person, you're a criminal being held in check.

In the interest of full disclosure, I’m both conservative and a “believer“… I find enlightenment in listening to both of you. I, too, am frustrated with JP’s unwillingness/inability to speak clearly to his religious beliefs. They do seem to be changing. That aside, I’m a great admirer and supporter of JP. He has and continues, I believe, to make a significant and positive difference in the world.

Shapiro/Daily Wire, in addition to believing his own hype, is what happened to him. He began to feel like an authority on everything when he clearly isn't. He should stay in his lane. Psychology is what he knows. that's what he should stick to.

Admittedly, I have not followed Dr. Peterson since joining the Daily Wire, but I recall him saying that atheists use a Judeo-Christian framework for their atheism. If you contend that God was the source/inspiration, you are a beneficiary of Divine value of your true self. I’m not a philosopher, so I lack the words.

The gray area between nuance and weaseling is narrower than JP realizes... or maybe he does. As a Christian, I resent Peterson playing on people's sincerely held beliefs for political ends. As far as I'm concerned, he's a practicing post-modernist, whatever he says about post-modernism notwithstanding. Very odd feeling for me to be siding with the atheist in a conversation like that.

To me, it is like Yin and Yang. The white has a black dot and the black has a white dot. No one 100% believes in God. If they did, they would have no fear. I’m pretty sure about that. The opposite, that no one is 100% atheist, I can’t say, for sure, that that is true mostly because I don’t know what they mean. But, I can say, that I’ve yet to find a person who did not worship something.

They talk about JP like he fell off or something.

Truth is not that simple. They argued about definition of it because it's something people have been struggling with for thousands of years. I do agree that Harris, makes the simplest interaction hard

Jordan Peterson's favorite word is substrate. 😂

I think what happened is Matt snapped a bit at Jordan over the the Secular Humanism discussion. Matt: "With all do apologies, you do not know the first thing about secular humanism!" ukposts.info/have/v-deo/fp15a4CMnIyCw2w.html

Peterson wanted to explore the nature of reality. Dillahunty seemed to have never given that any thought whatsoever. Thinking that "Truth is what comports to reality" is some profound statement.

This rigidity about who’s right or wrong for those other than themselves I find extraordinary. Why is it so difficult for people to simply agree to disagree with their inability to accept another’s personal opinion, or one’s ability to just carry uncertainty as to what another’s truth is. What is the harm done by harboring differences of belief, i.e., opinions? Are they corrupting the nation’s youth? I am inspired by one vision, you by another. You’re for God. I am not, or vice-versa. It’s a silly dallying IMO on a matter, which is not consequential to social cohesion unless it is made so by seriously rigid men and women.

A major problem with Peterson's expressed worldview is that he maintains that those 'important metaphorical truths' should actually be believed as truths (without qualifiers). While in reality it is quite enough for them to be simply metaphorical to be inspiring.

Jordan has, for the past few years, has gone through some horrific events in his life. I think he took a nihilistic approach and giving in to christianity. That's when you throw your arms up and give up. Most people do this in fascist or communist societies. He needed help and chose this route rather than reach out to a trusted colleague. I don't know Jordan personally, but based on his public figure...its what I see. Maybe a different approach (empathy and compassion). Giving up to feelings is not thinking. Jordan is a thinker.

It seemed obvious that JP was around just like the Washington Generals!

J.Peterson is psychologist. Let's not talk about him but about science he represents. " Psychology" Psychology is pseudoscience.., although it describes precisely human personalitys , personality disorders and mechanisms ruling human mind...We must give that to psychology... Therapeutical value psychology is discusable.( Probably works more effective that witchcraft and magic?)When Jordan talk from Psychology- science he is reliable. When he talks about different things like "faith&God " it's...just his point of view...

It seems everyone has his own solid explanation about what happened with him, though has anything changed? He seems like a usual JBP to me

A correlation is not a cause. To the extent audiences detect a change in Dr. Peterson, it occurred during his move to the Daily Wire, but that is coincidence. Any change occurred after his wife's near-death experience and his own almost simultaneous health scare. I attribute his religiosity to those. Clearly they had a profound impact on him and his perspective, and that may be coloring his view on religion. I recall lectures given before where he was quite reluctant to address religion; certainly his own. That's why his current approach seems such a departure. I counsel grace on the matter.

He fills the demand for people who can sound smart while advocating for the sky wizard.

what do we lose? accountability. a sense of awe and wonder for the mysterious and the miraculous.

The specific Jordan peterson conversation is like a fish living in water explaining to another fish that he also is living in water🐟💦 But the fish insist that there is no such thing as water, water means absolutely nothing to him💧 Yet in reality it means everything🌊

It's always the fairest ideal l to critique a person's views when they are not present. That said, I think these guys are fair-minded. But the situation prolly isn't completely fair to Jordan Peterson. I get the impression that JP thinks the stories about faith in God are utterly, metaphorically, psychologically true and real in some human adaptive sense. And he is purposely ignoring whether there is a metaphysical correspondence between the faith stories and God-reality or non-reality. Perhaps he thinks this question is unanswerable: Is God real? Perhaps he thinks that we can't know if God exists, but we can know (he seems to claim) that the stories work. Also, if you watch his recent conversation with Daniel Dennet, you'll see that his views are changing. Should I wait for fair responses or snarky smug ones?!

Douglas, what does “sanctity” mean as an atheist-agnostic?

Matt: "I care about what is true. Truth is that which comports to reality." So far so good... Also, Matt on the Atheist Experience: "I believe that men can become women." So much for Truth then...

He was kicked out of his country! His people turned on him! His answer was to get Christened!😊😂

All this ruckus just because JP seems to not be so flippant of religion?

Ironic…objective truth is the most important truth for Matt, but when it comes to the subjective “truth”of children who think they need sex reassignment surgery he is unsurprisingly un objective.

I once was ready to start a riot because someone was making light of Jesus in front of me. Tell me I never really believed and I know you have no idea what you're talking about.

Jordan believes that part of human nature is to worship something even if you don’t believe in anything. He doesn’t believe atheist believe in god in a hidden way just that without knowing the worship will go elsewhere without the person knowing it and he’ll claim it goes to power and authority. I think the enlightenment is being challenged and this is one of it’s current issues. I also think it’s healthy that the narrative on atheism can be challenged without just calling them sinners but also Atheist at this point can’t dismiss a religious person as a lunatic. I believe this is good progress.

Word salad.

Both are experts in spreading their intellectual idiocy that's supposed to sound wise. What's mindbogling is that some people actually believe in their nonsense

People have been arguing truth for thousands of years, but, I agree, it makes me feel all contemptuous and whiney when people just don't accept my definition of truth.

Peterson thinks all atheists are really believers in god. And he thinks that all believers in god really only believe in a metaphorical god. So he believes both that everyone is atheist and that no one is atheist, depending on how one chooses to define god. Which - even if it were true of the beliefs of all humans (which it isn't), and even if he had sufficient knowledge of all humans in order to make such a claim (which he doesn't) - advances the discussion not at all, except insofar as it tells us that Peterson has nothing of depth to contribute to it.

I’m sure Matt has many interesting things to say but I can never get past his self assured smugness and never last more than a few minutes listening to him.

It's funny how Matt thinks there's only one type of Truth, he just out himself on the fact that he have zero knowledge of philosophy and its basis, whether it'd be epistemology, metaphysics or value theory. It seems he mostly subscribe to Correspondence Theory of Truth

These people dont understand each other They smart maybe but wisdom and understanding are different

what what you will about Peterson, but his Kermit impression is spot on!

🤔 It is SO obvious that most people are, by choice & fundamentally, MORE "moral" than their own religions/ "gods" are. MORE moral, than what religions TELL people how a "god" wants them to act like.. That TOTALLY shows that it is NOT religions / gods that are the epitome of morality ( which they try to claim ). It shows that religions morals, are literally being dragged higher than they are, to keep up, with modern, secular, societies updated data & morality. 🤔🌏☮️

The sanctity, or worth of the individual exists regardless of differences in any measurable trait, including IQ. That is what should be taught and emphasised. Does being wary of it imply a value judgment?

10:13 If the brain is a gasoline motor then intelligence is power... and skepticism is the throttle. You get a lot more done using the throttle in a Geo Metro than idling a Hemi Charger.

He let fame get to his head . 🙄😤😮‍💨🤨

what's peterson afraid of? I imagine it's if his audience ever turns on him, his money source goes away... He's playing to that grifting world. And we all know how unstable and fickle that world is.

I'd like to take Matt's view on love sometime. What does he think of love? How much is it valued compared to reason and compared to the truth? Is reason more suited to lead us as a society than love? Maybe love is overrated?

Jordan Peterson refuses to say what he actually believes for one simple reason: He understands what "side" of the religion issue he's assumed to be on. It's why he, (or his publicist), gets calls and invites to debates and discussions. Jordan is going to be on stage facing off with someone who has said REPEATEDLY what they believe. If he were as clear and concise about what he ACTUALLY believes....his phone stops ringing. HE has painted himself into the corner he's in.

I don’t have any issue with Peterson. He’s beginning to grasp crucial spiritual truth in a way I didn’t think he ever would. It is inspiring.

DOES PETERSON BELIEVE THAT THERE IS A GOD ? IF SO WHICH ONE OR ONES . DOES PETERSON WORSHIP ANY GOD ? DOES PETERSON PERSONALLY FEAR GOING TO HELL FOR ANYTHING HE BELIEVES ? NEVER HEARD PETERSONS' ANSWERS TO THESE QUESTIONS. ANSWERS TO THEM WOULD GO A LONG WAY TO UNDERSTANDING THE MAN . RIGHT NOW I DONT UNDERSTAND HIM AT ALL

Peterson believes God is, in part, the highest good that you serve. One then must ask what a person would be like who didnt serve that highest good.

JBP became a business. That's all. I miss the old JBP, but I can't blame him for moving on with life. I do wish he would let his contract with Daily Wire expire, though. Also, isn't the boy on the right the one who hijacks whatever the talk is about and makes it about himself?

Douglas is almost as annoying as Peterson

Matt says he "knows what he grew up with" which is a large part of the problem. He was growing up 50 years ago, the world he knew, and the christianity he knew, is dead and buried. It simply doesnt exist anymore. The low-hanging fruit he has targeted over the years (while neglecting to address all serious positions) has held him firmly within his own comfort zone. He doesnt know what hes talking about and hes so completely out of his depth its embarrassing.

These conversations go no where because it’s about faith. Faith is not fact!! People make me believe in the devil 👿 itself. The Bible seems written in terms of light and dark….. if one lives in the light you will see things in that way, if you are dark you will be a zealot and its your way or no way . The Bible is for the individual and where their soul is.

Dillahunty talking about truth, goodness, and beauty reminds me of the proverb about fruit revealing the tree.

Peterson got out of his lane, but kept talking. That's his Achilles heel.

Matt's debate with Peterson is worth the watch, imo. I felt Matt made the most sense, by far. More sense than anybody else has made against Peterson.

Matt had a wonderful conversation with Jordan. I think Matt got the better of him honestly. After that I saw Matt say he would not outlaw 9 year olds from have Smex. It’s almost like everyone has crazy thoughts and should be treated as such. No one is perfect all the time

Seems like Matt really doesn't understand the argument...

Jordan plays intellectual 'card's with anyone who wants to play, AND...he does so while graciously, humbly and informatively showing everyone 'his' cards, AND...he even helps his opponents to better articulate and make 'their' point by giving them the surgical language necessary to build a more solid foundation and architecture of reason, that they might then build a better challenge to his own understanding. He also publicly draws attention to and calls into doubt elements of his own thinking that are not yet formalized, resolved or settled. He, alone, is not debating in aid of the rhetorical win, because...we either win together, through agreement, consensus, common understanding and acceptance, or we grow the abscess of malignancy that the loss incurs in our interlocutors minds on route to communal loss.

The conversation was productive, but JBP no longer wants to cast his pearls before swine. The issue was that, despite discussing nature of 'reality,' Matt is unable to discuss beyond how he sees the world in a naturalistic way. Jordan Peterson is trying to go beyond that.

I’d like to see Matt debate Bishop Robert Barron. I’d pay to see that.

Forget God.... convince me that conscience exists. And if it doesn't....as Sam Harris explains....then you don't exist (regardless of DeCartes famous quote).

He’s outlived his usefulness in debate. He is so unhinged by his religion it’s pitiful. I,m a leftest, but I appreciated him the first year. But he’s done.

Screw religion. Find God.

I sometimes wonder if we all are actually in the same " reality. " From my very shallow perspective it looks like . . . NOT. So if truth is what comports with " reality " . . . we're back to the same question. Is reality the same for everyone ?????

I admire JPs stance on the plague of feminism and wokeism. I also have great respect for his stance on C16. Its in matters if religion where he turns into yet another snake oil apologist huckster playing semantics.

I love Jordan Peterson for what it’s worth.

I think it’s funny that smart guys who consider themselves well educated and able to dissect challenging issues so quickly reduce the ideas and philosophy of others simply because they don’t align with what they believe. It’s very hypocritical.

Taking about IQ differences is nothing like talking about the Jews. It's inherently meaningful wherever it appears.

Not sure why people take JP seriously.....is it because he's popular? I hate to be crude, but he's little more than a BS merchant living off an ill founded reputation. Even his famous uni psychology lectures I found to be shallow and unconvincing.....

he became a born again and now has to follow the BS

Believe in G-d? What are you believing? We don't have the capability to comprehend what (who) G-d is. G-d is not what we think.

7:40 “I don’t want to belabor this” so he goes right on and belabors the point 😂

Dillahunty is out of JP’s intellectual league…and so he’s venting a lil’ bit.

The real problem with atheism is that it is very self centered. Life is not so much about self, but relationships. And the deepest relationships are those between God and mankind. Trying to live a life without God leads to not only autonomy from God but also autonomy from others.

I regret watching the first two minutes of this. Are people not allowed to change?? What a strange sentiment.

For most people dreams are not 'real'and therefore contain no truth but they ARE part of reality. Truth is al rational concept. Faith is a relational concept having ever so much value. Gods name is a verb. There is no theology but a devine antropology, uplifting human existance, giving them the ability of choice in an event, a happening, not in history defined as a proces.

Kermit the Fraud

Jordan Peterson seems fine to me, I don’t see any problem

He broke out The Matrix. It's all MASS MK Ultra. Question Authority.

People should look at the Buddha’s teachings…absolutely no blind beliefs but a path that does work to get one out of suffering if one follows it …but 100% you try it and see the results…no one tells you what to believe and you don’t believe unless it comes from your own experience.

Jordan Peterson's intellect is on another level than Matt Dillahunty's. He embarrassed himself by agreeing to go on the same stage as Dillahunty, as did Douglas Murray.

They just refuse to acknowledge Dr. Peterson's definitions of words and then debunk his arguments based on their own definitions, which they think are dumb, which is why they became Atheists. It's not about them accepting his definitions, it's about them getting along with the Petersons definitions for the sake of the argument. What they do makes sense if you just want to be right, not when you want to learn something new.

Some people say Peterson fell off but he was never "on"

Ok.. next question what is reality

That being said the majority of people just want equity in high status jobs.

You can't talk about God and not confront belief. Reason and being reasonable only takes you so far. The 2 types of rational limits are the telescope and math. The rational foundations are empiricism and coherentism. Both are beliefs. Empiricism makes discoveries and those discoveries extrapolate belief: leads one to believe in further things that, based on the discovery, seems to "reasonably" follow. Coherentism asserts theories and based on a rational interpretation called a mathematical model, those interpretations lead to calculations whose solutions can be "measured", indirectly, with instruments or observed directly. Belief in math extrapolates discovery. An assumption, Theory, leads to discovery, discovery leads to the extrapolation of belief (rational thought) which further leads to assumptions. This reaching of reason, this seeking for completeness among the incomplete, is a slow process of gains and setbacks. Gains and setbacks due to arrogant beliefs and insecure beliefs: dogma and skepticism. Besides this dogma and skepticism there is faith. Faith is neither arrogant belief or insecure belief. Faith is the attitude of belief itself. It is neither knowing nor doubting. Do you believe that Jesus was born of a virgin? The only "reason" you would fear to say one way or the other is ridicule. Do you believe in ufo's? Aliens? A cure for cancer? Magic? Unicorns? If you are Religious and don't believe in the Virgin birth, then what does that say about you? That you're afraid to be thought of as irrational? That you cling to reason as a crutch? A crutch to prop up what? Reason props up vanity. Is reason just as much a sin as pride, envy, Wrath, sloth, avarice, gluttony and lust? Yes, because too much of anything makes one vain. "OH what a good boy am i." as Joseph Campbell used to say. Who else besides Peterson is afraid to profess his belief in the Virgin Birth? Ask yourself why you're not afraid to believe in the Big Bang as well?

This video starts out will with a discussion of establishing truth through the examination of facts, but it ends badly when the subject turns to IQ. The reaction is to avoid studying the subject because the examination of facts might lead to a truth that is too uncomfortable.

I just love you guys...thank you for saying what we can't.

It’s unfortunate because I believe(haha) Jordan has a point about belief and God, but he hides the ball so much and seems to get into weird power games with people in conversation where he’ll be intellectually dishonest just to avoid adopting a specific position.

I enjoy some of the debates JP has, but in regard to religion i dont agree with his veiws at all. I saw the debate and it wasnt JPs strongest moment.

Most athiests I know won't talk about spirituality full stop. - Heres the thing, if you throw yourself out there (like on YT) you're gonna attract the loons. Both evangelists, and athiests; neither know what they are. - both are responsible for the quieting of spititual discourse, over a long period of time, because the masses don't wanna deal with idiots who only rock up to preach their intolerance at you, from either extreme. Sharing conversation on spirituality is communial; but spirituality is deeply personal in all other respects. Theres no mass psychology to it. As gov'ts have learnt hundreds of years ago when they tried to adopt, what they considered "its methods" for political reasons, only to end with a violent heresy. - and only got themselves in trouble. The thing I think is a great shame, is that individuals no longer feel comfortable discussing their deeper sense of spirituality. - and its killing us inside. - Historically, this served as an anchor as society erected its commonly shared values politically. When it is said, "all our morals and principles came from Christianity" (for example) - Its not LITERALLY thats what happened! 😅 No, spirituality tempered masses of people "in order so that they could" discuss these deeper things, and define them. It just got people to talk, instead of fight about everything. There is no such thing as 'spiritual society', that would be a theocracy. I am a spiritual person IN my society, not the other way around. Nor is the church a "society"; the age-old description "world university" is a very apt one. We all have instinct, and we all have logic, and we all have spirituality. - but, theres no way in the world I'm going to share deeply personal things about me, unless I detect through other conversation, that person is on a similar wavelength. Much like many people in my life are surprised to learn of my relationship with platonic reality. - We were a lot better off when we were wary of trying to read people like the cover of book. I'm not gonna get stuck into Jordan Peterson because its obvious to any of us that he is not a good situation. - I don't know him personally. - However, I suspect he knows that situation would dramatically improve for him and his family, if he left Canada; yet I suspect he knows something others could learn - that you have no right to speak of a nation you left behind.

There is a moral foundation for Atheism its called LIFE and everything that promotes and supports it. Yet Life and everything that supports it must have come from something and not nothing. Whether we understand it or not, or believe it or not, does not change this condition.

He said souls