PROBLEM SOLVED - USE RUBBER CABLE INSTEAD OF ARMOURED CABLE?
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День томуWe couldn't route this armoured cable to our CTEK EV charger so we had to find a solution.
In this video, we join Doncaster Cables EV Ultra SWA cable to a piece of Titanex HO7-RNF cable using a Wiska six-eight shark joint.
Next time around should we just use HO7-RNF rubber cable for the complete installation?
Here's the kit used in this series
C-TEK Chargestorm 2 - 2 x 22kW EV charge point
⚡️ hub.efixx.co.uk/CTEK-Chargestorm
EV Blocks
EV Tower charger pedestal
Matt:e Three Phase PEN fault protection
TIS Pro Multifunction tester
Doncaster Cables EV Ultra - 5 x 16mm sq plus data
EV Comply - installation management
Wiska shark 69 cable joint
Sacs cable stripping tool
Titanex HO7RNF
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🕐 TIME STAMPS 🕕
======================
00:00 EV charger installation cable continues
00:20 We've got a problem
00:50 Should we have just used a rubber cable?
01:30 How do we join SWA to a Rubber cable?
01:50 Sacs cable stripping tool
03:00 Wiska six eight gel cable joint
07:00 Dealing with the data cable
10:00 Closing the gel joint
11:00 TUK cable joint for data cable
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#efixx #electricians #evcharger
@havoctrousers 2 роки тому
I think you might as well use a separate duct grade cat5e cable rather than faffing around with jointing to the one in your EV ultra armoured. If you're running in ducting anyway, why bother with adding the armoured joint when you could just use the rubber cable for the full run? Don't want to sound negative though, thank you for the interesting videos and showing us new ideas and products!
@we-are-electric1445 2 роки тому
I agree with that !
@karljones4321 2 роки тому
I haven't used much rubber cable, but I suppose, the rubber cable could be damaged by rodents easier (if they get into the ducting) and perhaps the rubber insulation could deteriorate quicker?
@markwhoeverdafuck4114 2 роки тому
More expensive
@43ten43 2 роки тому
That's what they asked [the viewers] about at the beginning of the video.
@adventuremax Рік тому
@@karljones4321 the rubber H07RN-F cable is not designed for fixed wiring applications and it's current carrying capacity and cable characteristics (volt drop etc) don't align with the equivalent size SWA cable, and a plastic duct offers no mechanical protection so the cable is vulnerable to mechanical damage unless the trench is backfilled with sufficient concrete
@mikeselectricstuff 2 роки тому
7:56 don't forget to check both ends of the cable to see which has the best layout to go into the terminals.
@d.beaumont9157 2 роки тому
My thoughts exactly. Checking rotation so the phases are in line would be crucial to make this joint work.
@pear7777 2 роки тому
Hmm, never would have thought of that, good point.👍
@gnlgrim2 Рік тому
I would drill a exit hole lower on the pillar and you can make a neat bend. Joints are a extra point of failure. But everyone has their prefrences. Love the videos you guys do.
@bobthesparky 2 роки тому
Rubber cables are the way forward. SWAs/AWAS are pretty much impossible to terminate in some of the larger EV installs. Some manufacturers are now beginning to class their HO7RN as duct grade.
@adventuremax Рік тому
the rubber H07RN-F cable is not designed for fixed wiring applications and it's current carrying capacity and cable characteristics (volt drop etc) don't align with the equivalent size SWA cable, and a plastic duct offers no mechanical protection so the cable is vulnerable to mechanical damage unless the trench is backfilled with sufficient concrete
@OldLordSpeedy 2 роки тому
Federal Republic of Germany - we use H07RN-F outside for heavy uses, e.g. construction site areas, coal mining areas, music scene, camping place areas, aso., where we change the cable way normally often. Same for EV-things, solar parks, etc. - often inside plastic pipe outside or inside the soil if it hard wired same you demonstration it. Of course, RCD 30mA (or less) after CU it is every time a good idea for outside cables - with or without CEE-sockets between.
@plunder1956 8 місяців тому
Most interesting to see these lovely quality IP68 jointing systems and how they should be handled.
@thattoolguy9432 2 роки тому
Big downside to using H07 in ducts is mice and rats will have a good chew on it, had it happen way too often.. it's those cheap posts, needs to be designed with a JB enclosure where you could terminate an armoured then come off with something more sensible for the ev charger terminals
@efixx 2 роки тому
Rats and mice in Skipton! - wise words on the rodents!
@thattoolguy9432 2 роки тому
@@efixx Plenty of field mice oop norf ... ive used the smaller wiska box with mixed results, not sure about the lager one .. prefer to crimp larger cables in joints
@boblewis5558 2 роки тому
It's not the rats and mice you need to worry about in Skipton ... It's the wolves, bears and beavers! It's rough up North! 🤣🤣🤣
@jenton93 2 роки тому
@@boblewis5558 you should pick better women
@boblewis5558 2 роки тому
@@jenton93 sorry! Didn't realise it was a dating site!
@havaden96 Рік тому
The standard in Norway is now pretty much to use TEC-FLEX RV-K 0,6/1,0KV. Its a UV resistant double layer pvc cable with XLPE insulation. Super flexable especially in warm weather and can actually be buried straight down into the ground with no further protection, still following our code. However i allways use PEM plastic water lines to protect it.
@seantaylor9758 2 роки тому
Good to use rubber cables and certainly more appropriate in many situations. As for the gel seal joint they are all well and good but can break down. Having used gel joints in the telco industry for years they are certainly easy but not totally reliable. It was always a no no to have telephone cable in the same duct as power for reasons of noise and inductance and perhaps more importantly contact which could be fatel if not expecting high votages on the cat5 where i wouldn't want to see any more than 50V. Once again great video and highly informative.
@NickToland 2 роки тому
Yes! The rubberized cable is amazing, with relevant protection both physical and electrical.
@bitTorrenter 2 роки тому
Why design an unarmoured cable as alternative to an armoured one, only to require the 'relevant protection' required?
@NickToland 2 роки тому
@@bitTorrenter easier to work with
@joem9124 2 роки тому
I work in the film industry and we use H07RN-F all the time it's awesome
@smintzinho Рік тому
Guys! I am very impressed with the skills and the tools available there! I am from Brazil, actually living in Canada and the latest tech tools and those kits are times ahead from what we find there in Brazil.. I am quite interested in watching more videos in this Channel! just subscribed and liked the video
@OmmerSyssel Рік тому
German Knipex and Wiha make excellent tools.
@martinw.2351 2 роки тому
I love your video - perfect installation 👍
@HeathenGeek 2 роки тому
I think the inability / difficulty with getting armoured cable to where it's actually needed is a failure of design by the manufacturer of the EV charger. How about making a charger, and stand that can actually accept an swa! Hmm. . . seems like there's a gap in the market here
@filipe.skunk8 2 роки тому
Not sure if I should laugh or if I should cry..
@gubbernl 2 роки тому
I absolutely agree, get an other stand!
@filipe.skunk8 2 роки тому
The inability of the British electrician providing an infrastructure and run a normal cable inside it is also a big failure.. how about getting into the 21st century and stop doing things in the most rudimentary way?
@supersparks9466 2 роки тому
@filipe s spill the beans and tell us what we’re doing wrong?
@filipe.skunk8 2 роки тому
@@supersparks9466 i just said it above 🤷🏻♂️ why do you guys use swa as a one for all solution when there’s so many suitable options that can be run inside a tube..? Laziness to create a bit of infrastructure and a couple man holes? 🤷🏻♂️ this immagrunt is only complaining about what he always complained about in this country electric industry.. so advanced faffing around with testing little wires but so primitive in the execution..
@francescodiraffaele4985 11 місяців тому
really excellent gel joints… great video
@PHealey1981 2 роки тому
Very good gentlemen. Top job
@izalman Рік тому
Used H07 cable to replace and extend the power cable on my new ovens, both had 16a demand so used the 4mm cable with the blue industrial sockets. Fed from CU in 6mm T&E. Used enough cable to allow the ovens to be pulled from the housing and sit on a work bench if needed. Fortunately had enough space at the back of the ovens / housing to do this.
@tcpnetworks 2 роки тому
Australian here - we use Clipsal 56-series style connector (like your commando connectors) above ground, or immediately below ground (so long as drainage is there) so there's a breakaway connector if the pedistal gets knocked-over. This means we can safely isolate and repair without the need of messing with gel connectors. It does mean you end up with a different pedistal design.
@johnburns4017 2 роки тому
Good way to do it. Below ground in the UK would mean moisture would degrade the 'commando' connector. We are a 'wet' country.
@CoolSteve08 2 роки тому
@@johnburns4017 and you can tell that the UK is a wet country as soon as they showed the inside of the box near the beginning of the video, as the ducting box had a puddle of water at the bottom of it. I'm curious how well they hold up in exceptionally wet conditions where those ducting boxes end up with an extreme amount of water in them. In the case the pedestal gets damaged and requires to be replaced, I imagine replacing the rubberised cable from the junction box is easier than having to pull the whole length of cable through again.
@johnburns4017 2 роки тому
@@CoolSteve08 A new waterproof spice.
@jonathanbuzzard1376 Рік тому
@@johnburns4017 You do know you can go to IP69 with IEC60309/Commando connectors? If they "degrade" then they should not be rated IP69 in the first place and the joint they used was only IP68 rated.
@Rosscoff2000 2 роки тому
If it's protected in a duct rather than direct burial I'd say much better to run the tough rubber throughout, rather than introduce a complex joint as another potential point of failure. Also run external grade Cat 5 in one run, again avoiding a joint and avoiding exposing that non externally rated section between the gel joint and the Cat5 joint. Also bringing out the Cat5 beside the flex can compromise the adhesive lining seal of the shrink tube which could provide a channel that will actually promote wicking of water into the connector circumventing the gel.
@ck101085 Рік тому
we use a rubber subcab cable four pump installs. the best cable by far. lovely to work with
@martinbarrett831 Рік тому
Great to see the SACS tool being used. Shame not used on longitudinal cut. It does require practice and skill to fully enjoy its benefits.
@benjaminvanstone3665 Рік тому
Great example of a nice solution. Only extra step I would take would be using shielded RJ45 plugs in the join to keep the screen continuous to the charger. 👍🏻
@bertusmannus4149 Рік тому
Ditto… the cable was shielded and the RJ45 plugs used were only to CAT5 standard so they need to offer the metal continuity screening capability, as does the IP68 connector… or just run a fresh pair of separate CAT6/7 exterior grade cables, being aware that not all shielded RJ45 plugs can take the heavier grade of exterior cable. I’ve said to run a pair of CAT6/7 cables in anticipation of a future failure; given the low cable cost, it makes sense early on to plan ahead and consider the inevitable failure. Depending on weather/climate conditions in the duct/pillar you may only get a few years before failures appear. How many EV charge points around are offline due to failures? In most cases it’s the data link that has failed, not the supply cable.
@brrymcgolly Рік тому
That was brilliant. Thank.
@JamesJames-um5xq 2 роки тому
Great vid once again guys. Would you know if there are specific measurements for outer sheathing to be removed from the cable (to expose the wire) in relation to the size of SWA gland (20s, 20, 25 ect ect). I see in the vid he uses a square set to a certain distance. For 20-25mm glands ive always used the width of some tape plus half a thumb but often wonder if there are specific measurements that can be used for an optimum fit; this is especially the case with CW waterproof glands where its all too easy to remove too much of the sheathing and end up with the wire showing outside the gland and its waterproof bung, which defeats the point of a waterproof gland. Maybe you could do a vid on it !! Cheers
@TheClashen Рік тому
As always a very high standard of work. However one question for you, as you guys are often the championing the use of tightens torques on connections which I think is particularly relevant on connections that are not easily checked in planned maintenance schedules. Like this one. You also mentioned relaxation and the need of a retightening which is a very good point. Many other types of mechanical fixture connection procedures often will detail time scales to re-torquing of mechanical connectors to account for creep as a property of materials with temperature bands detailed, etc. We used to have to do daily checks of our torque wrenches with a norbar tester. A wee saying our professor in Power Engineering used to say “I have never known an Electron to fail, electrical failures are always mechanical in nature” not that he was prone to any form of bias. This came to mind after just looking into 1/4 inch torque wrenches of 1/4 inch hex grub screws that specified 39nm when all the 1/4 inch drive torque wrenches I could easily find had a limit of 25nm. Needed a visit to Amazon for a drive adapter. This is with bearing in mind that we all have calibrated arms and wrists for matching desired torques. 😂
@jephthahjackson1095 Рік тому
Ace..dear
@Farbeyondhell 2 роки тому
In London, we see rodent issues more than most. I’d consider the longevity of H07 before specifying it over distance through duct.
@efixx 2 роки тому
wise words
@rondo122 2 роки тому
thanks for this good video!
@seandempsey7351 2 роки тому
Wow Gaz and Gordon doing some electrical work 👍😂 or was it someone else in the close up shots ? .. I never will understand why you got someone else in to do the electrical work in your new unit When your both qualified electricians and perfectly capable of doing the the work you’re self’s . But who am I to say , i’am just a humble spark who’s opinion means nothing 🤣. That gell joint looks like a fantastic and easy way way to join the cables and I think SWA would have been a bit of a pig for that job . Fantastic video guy’s as always 👍👍👍👍❤️
@barrysmith3123 Рік тому
I used a shark joint several years ago for joining a damaged water pump cable as it was recommended by my wholesaler. Once I’d done the connection, I dropped it in the water slowly with my fingers crossed. 10 seconds later the rcd tripped. Not used them since then.
@dg2908 2 роки тому
Does the 16mm IP68 joint need to remain accessible or is it maintenance free?
@arcadia1701e 2 роки тому
I love the ho7rn cables. Use them in many places. Work shops for connecting to heavy machines to there 64 amp plugs mostly.
@OmmerSyssel Рік тому
H07BQ-F is even better for tough environment. Not even Forklifts can ruin it ...
@adambrammeld9286 2 роки тому
We’ve got 3 big three phase boards running off a big generator due to a damaged cable during some groundwork’s. The Rubber is still good now. No problems at all 👍
@FirstDan2000 2 роки тому
I'm puzzled by the thumbnail for the video. It shows a tick next to the rubber cable and a cross next to the SWA. Is this because of the rotation of the coloured cores not matching? I'm assuming so, since the video was quite informative and reassuring of the cable types jointed.
@affy675 2 роки тому
Recently worked in a university research/engineering complex and the entire installation was wired in HO7 cable. Only issue i could see was not all terminations were made using ferrules.
@marikann9073 2 роки тому
Depends on the terminal the fine stranded is joined to. Some spring loaded connectors from the likes of PhoenixContact etc. or properly sized cage clamps actually recommend against using ferrules. So not every missing ferrule is a violation.
@Emin3m1986 2 роки тому
Can you link the relevant video for re exporting the CPC connection, please ? I’m searching it on YT and can’t find it. Thanks guys!
@imark7777777 2 роки тому
I think this is a great solution from what I've seen from the poured joints they're permanent this is something that could be undone and repaired, replaced without having to snip off some shortening the cable that you probably don't have enough of.
@largey2541 2 роки тому
Work with H07 and SWA every day. H07 is the cable you want for the big cable pulls. It’s mostly used for motors and pumps.
@edc1569 2 роки тому
Ah, just run the data on a separate cable!
@NBundyElectrical 2 роки тому
great videos guys
@efixx 2 роки тому
Cheers Nick - We love a challenge!
@JAxford 2 роки тому
I didn't see any grease in the cat cable. Is the cat cable manufactured for underground use outside of the main sheath of the composite cable?
@dashgordon4525 2 роки тому
As this gel joint has screw terminals, would I be right in saying they must always be accessible for maintenance as I thought screw terminals are not classed as a non maintainable Mechanical joint?
@robertwilliams7222 2 роки тому
It is accessible! It’s right there under the charge point!🤷🏼♂️
@dashgordon4525 2 роки тому
I agree with you Mr Williams. I still feel it is a worthy point to make as I am sure there may be a modicum of newbies that might assume it could be buried like the old resin torpedos with crimped connections.
@barrieshepherd7694 2 роки тому
@@dashgordon4525 Even if it shouldn't it will be !
@acespark1 2 роки тому
Already had to do exactly what you have just shown because there is no way to gland an armoured cable into the EV charge point I was supplied by the client
@ryanjones7921 2 роки тому
38 seconds in and I caught my misses chuckling 🤭,,
@oyleyhands1332 2 роки тому
I'm pretty sure that Ideal made that sheath stripper back in the early 80's, it had an ecentric blade that circles the sheath then rotates to strip lengthways.. I may still have one ! of course, it was blue and company issue at the time.
@kathrynwhitby9799 2 роки тому
BT had a similar one.
@OmmerSyssel Рік тому
Knipex makes one slightly more advanced
@RaithUK 2 роки тому
Another great video there guys, In short.. if mechanically protected and electrically protected then why would you not use easier to work with cable.. H07 all the way..
@MrMolloy88 Рік тому
I work as an project engineer across Europe and we only use N2XH and H07Z for permeant installations.
@super539 2 роки тому
a reference to VICTOR KIAM all the way across the pond? That's a deep reference ! :)
@dannyte83 2 роки тому
I like a wiska product, but that is never going to last like a resin joint… it’ll be living under water most of the winter 😂
@pselectrical4561 Рік тому
Hello.. Are they classed as maintenance free connections with screws to clamp the cables? I would prefer the standard underground joint kit. Thanks
@TbjrL 2 роки тому
In my IWP we fitted an EV charger and only used HO7, only because we could fit it through a steel drain right beside the back door then feed it through to the attic and down to the CU, I myself didn't make the terminations I just assisted in keeping the wire straight when feeding it through and fitting it to the wall. So I'd say if reasonable protection is able able be improvised by the environment then use HO7 but if at any point there's a chance that the wire could be mechanically compromised then terminate it back to or fully through with SWA, although if we had to use SWA the whole way through we'd probably would be been there for a whole say and probably after terminations getting bad IR readings. Also that house was crazy close to max current capacity, it had a B&B attached to it and having to have an EV charger meant that the owner had to reconsider certain circuits. We fixed up 2 radials and made it one whole loop.
@mattylad8035 2 роки тому
So when you joined the CAT5 cable, it was actually CAT5a with a screen around it, you used non screened connectors so the final length of it had an incorrectly grounded screen. Unless you also did not use a screened connector at the indoors end, in which case the entire run was not screened correctly.
@CoolSteve08 2 роки тому
Given they don't use the armour as any kind of "earth", I wonder if they wouldn't use screened cable here for fear of introducing another earth path.
@Thats_Mr_Random_Person_to_you 2 роки тому
@@CoolSteve08 in those cases (ie running screened cables where the is a significant chance of different earth potentials) you only connect the screen to one of the crimp terminals, and not to the other - so the cable is screened, but not connected at one of the crimp ends to avoid creating an earth loop.
@timbo19 2 роки тому
Your terminology is wrong. Firstly, no such thing as CAT5a. It's CAT5e with the 'e' meaning 'enhanced'. CAT5 is an obsolete standard and is replaced by CAT5e. CAT5e can come in both shielded and unshielded variants and there are different forms of shielding too e.g. S/FTP, F/UTP and others, all covered by the general term of STP. The CAT5e shown in the EV Ultra cable here appears to be of the F/UTP variety meaning it has an overall foil shield around the pairs which are not individually shielded themselves. My understanding is that the current EV chargers don't require shielded CAT5e, many of them simply using it as a means of connecting the current transformers so it's not even digital data being carried. The fact that they have not used the shield in this example is therefore not critical.
@geraldelwood9660 2 роки тому
Why did you strip 20mm of the outer covering off the armour, before covering it with the short length of heat shrink?
@jollyfinequality9865 2 роки тому
At a guess, this was to pick up the earth connection with the spring loaded earth band, as you would do in a standard torpedo joint and then realised it wasn't required.
@geraldelwood9660 2 роки тому
@@jollyfinequality9865 I expect you are right. I would have thought they would have edited that bit out and gone straight to the heat shrink collapsing onto the cable 😀
@geraldelwood9660 2 роки тому
@@jollyfinequality9865 I'm also in two minds about the outer layer of heat shrink trapping the data cable to the power cable. Because it extends beyond the gel into the gland, if the gland itself is not totally waterproof, then there could be a risk of water tracking under the heat shrink in the gaps between the cables. Hopefully that last inch between the heat shrink and the terminals will be sufficient gel to do the job. Perhaps use two short sections of heat shrink, with a decent gap, to allow the gel to get in and do its job.
@havoctrousers 2 роки тому
I assumed it was force of habit and whoever did it forgot they weren't putting a gland on
@HenryLoenwind 2 роки тому
To properly glue down the armour strands. If they are left ending with the outer cable insulation, they are not held in place and butt the heat shrink. That way they could poke through the heat shrink when the cable is handled. When pressed flat between inner insulation and heat shrink it is much less likely for them to do that, they'd just slide between the two.
@Ressy66 2 роки тому
gel joints are awesome - i'm only telecoms and data, they are great, and super fast to for eg, fix a copper phone leadin that mr citizen has run his spade through whilst his missus stands over him guiding him to dig out that new landscape feature. So much easier than messing around with rosins, and risking spilling the muck all over customers property, it was a sparky who first showed me the use for them, love em.
@125brat 6 місяців тому
Would it be an option to swap ends for the HO7 cable so the core rotation matches the connector block, either that or a bit of forward thinking and trying to match the positions of the wires for the joint before cutting anything?
@AintBigAintClever Рік тому
Would it be better to either use cold-shrink or a long non-shrink (long enough that it can't slide far enough to bring Cat.5 in contact with live screws)? I'd be concerned about melting the insulation of the 8 inner cores, especially at the end of what won't be a cheap cable. The two-cable exit would be tricky though, Woer do cold-shrink with sealing mastic for telecom use which might fit the bill.
@sstorholm 2 роки тому
Not an electrician myself, but an IT engineer, and we run a lot of big rubber cables in data centers, I personally like them as they drape very neatly on shelves, and can be ran under raised floors as well. If memory serves they have quite high current ratings as well compared to their cross section, which of course is advantageous. Good on you guys for doing the data cable properly, as an IT guy I hate it when people treat data cabling as fancy telegraph wiring. 😂 However, I’m not so sure about the signal integrity of that cable, commonly we avoid running them parallel with high current power cabling (low signal cabling should preferably only cross power cabling at right angles), and that cable doesn’t even seem to be shielded, and if so, it should be terminated with shielded connectors and joined with shielded joining blocks. If you have access to a data certification tester, I’d be very interested in seeing if it’ll pass CAT5 and CAT6 certification.
@user-xv5iw5zh4m 2 роки тому
I hate screw joints, and I wouldn't have put the Cat5 cable in the joining box, since when you put two cables through one hole the water will get in through where the cables touch each other
@mwkp38 Рік тому
Is twin wall ducting classed as having “equivalent mechanical protection”? The reg states “Except where installed in a conduit or duct which provides equivalent protection against mechanical damage, a cable buried in the ground shall incorporate an earthed armour or metal sheath or both, suitable for use as a protective conductor.” How do we determine “equivalent”?
@barryedge5013 2 роки тому
In the video the question is put to us whether or not to use HO7 cable for the full run or just stick to the method used in the video. There like in most cases arguments for and against this, and I’m not going to preach my own agenda here, I wanted to merely point out that HO7 cable is rated as flexible cable and as such has is own usage guides in BS7671. I work in the water industry and most pumps come from the manufacturer with a form of this cable e.g. Flygt,s SUBCAB cable, and in most cases this can’t be connected to the motor drive directly, usually due to distances. So we would always use an armoured cable as the extension with a suitable JB connection. In conclusion I believe what was done in the video is quite correct, however I would tend to use a separate data cable as joists can cause issues and it may make the supply cable a little cheaper to install.
@dennisphoenix1 2 роки тому
Whether .
@darren92redrum67 Рік тому
Terminal blocks and pvc tape👌
@rkalle66 Рік тому
A flexible cable will do fine. Charging columns in a parking area are prone to be hit by cars/trucks and sooner or later will need repair. Maybe future models will slip just over the cable coming out of the base making it easier to install. First the cable, next the box column and not first the column and then the cable.
@oyleyhands1332 2 роки тому
I was thinking that, if a mains cable was run in a containment system within a building, would one install a mains cable and a cat5 cable withing that same containemens system ? especially if it were not a segretated containment system ? as there is no segregation with that cable sheath that I can see. Are there regulations covering this situation ?
@stuartcotterill9475 Рік тому
Hi, is there any kind of plug I can put on a 2.5mm 3 core swa cable? It will only be used as an "extension lead" from an outdoor socket to power my shed. I thought about just swapping the outdoor socket to a commando socket and using a commando plug but unsure if it will fit.
@octymocty132 2 роки тому
As per every thing its that application that matters I would say swa if it was a trench ya have to dig in grass and mud as extra security and pice of mind im case some twonk accidently dug into the install ( previous experience ) But as ya going through existing underground ducting the either cable for your install
@JimWhitaker 2 роки тому
Surely the need for that joint is the mistake. Why not use the HO7 cable throughout? (And Cat 5/6/7 as specified.)
@carlmarquardt994 2 роки тому
Did the swa armour get earthed at the incoming supply end?
@user-qi6ez4se4r 9 місяців тому
Do you guys ever use mine spec trailing cables in the UK? Alot more flexible than SWA, it has a very thick rubber coating with woven kevlar fibers inbuilt, 3x earths and a small pilot cable in the very centre of the cable which cuts power if earth continuity is lost, pilot continuity is lost or in the case of a pilot core to earth short circuit (pilot healthy signal goes through a diode). Plus each phase has a semicon outer which trips out on a phase/earth fault if it gets damaged. I've literally seen it get run over by trucks/50 tonne boggers, and get skulldragged over all sorts of bullshit and stay working far exceeding what SWA cable could ever take whilst IMO being way safer. I've seen it take all sorts of beating and keep going, but never seen it fail in a unsafe way, it always has tripped out power whenever damaged
@mikeselectricstuff 2 роки тому
Coudn you have stripped off the sheath & armouring to make it more flexible & run it in flexicon to the chargepoint?
@efixx 2 роки тому
We did consider this but the XLPE class 2 conductors only have 7 strands so not very flexible.
@JAUS95 2 роки тому
Is SWA not safer than this rubber cable? As if the cable is damaged swa provides protection if struck by tools
@avfczoff 11 місяців тому
3 Mins 14 secs in is that a standard shroud or a particular one used to cover the armouring?
@muzikman2008 2 роки тому
All types of cables have their applications and uses. I think SWA is better than H07-RNF cables for underground use. As it's name suggests it is "armoured" against spades, diggers, Rodents, etc..I always feel like tough rubber cables are an easy way out of doing a job properly, especially in gardens, a spade will still go throught it with risk of shock to the person chopping through it, At least with a SWA they have to cut through the Armour (CPC) before hitting live cables. With HO7-RNF they could hit a Live cable first. The least joints the better. Swa Underground, and then terminate above ground into the charger I would say. But thats just me lol.
@G6EJD 2 роки тому
Rubber v Armoured, doesn’t it depend on the upstream protection? If an RCD (or equivalent) is fitted then Rubber would be OK, as protected against future ground works that have not carried out a ground scan.
@SME_Ste 2 роки тому
Theres no requirement for an RCD to protect from groundworks like in this installation. Buried in a plaster wall would be a different situation tho.
@derekgoodwin6646 2 роки тому
Iagree belts and braces.
@gpapagi Рік тому
Shouldn't there be a local PE rod for that charger instead of extending it from the supply point?
@allthegearnoidea6752 2 роки тому
Are these cables listed in the 18th edition. It worries me using cables that aren’t listed.
@TheEulerID Рік тому
I can't say, addition heat-shrink layer or not, I like a data cable being in touch with mains voltage terminals. It would be nice to have a much more robust separator. I guess the connector was never designed with being shared with data in the first place, but it doesn't strike me as ideal. For that matter, I'm not sure I much like the idea of cat-5 embedded in a mains cable in the first place.
@oliverriall Рік тому
With you on that one mate. Seems like you would have to say low likelihood but high consequence on the old risk assessment on that one, I love cat6 swa, that stuff is bomb proof, and probably cheaper to buy 5 core swa and separate cat6 swa then a highly specialised wire.
@dannyakqj101 2 роки тому
I really like that install and all the protection. Done in a work shop that joint is doable, think a poured joint would be easier if you was outside working in a hole though. The connector inside that joint is far too big. Excellent work though, I do like it.
@charmio 2 роки тому
Just my personal opinion, I wouldn’t’ve put heatshrink around the power and cat5 9:45. I’m concerned it could block the gel and be a path for water to track up. Also, I’ve found that the thin insulation on the individual wires in a cat5 cable is surprisingly easy to melt together with a heat gun if you’re not careful.
@noelburke6224 Рік тому
You are right about the cat 5 cable should be run separately and one rubber cable run completely without joining
@mfr58 9 місяців тому
@@noelburke6224 Yeah, the insulation on the cat5 is easy to melt. As far as moisture ingress goes, the heatshrink they used was adhesive filled, so it shouldn't cause a problem with moisture ingress.
@doomain6769 2 роки тому
Would it be possible to use S.Y cable for the installation with a note on certificate of departure from bs7671 as S.Y doesn't have a Bs classification code ?
@pselectrical4561 Рік тому
From my experience SY cable rots pretty quickly when use externally.. thanks
@billalhossain3134 2 роки тому
Hi at 9.49 minutes & before this gets connected upstream. Is there any way to test the cable connections, particularly the ethernet connections. Cheers
@garethrendle3766 2 роки тому
I am not keen on the cat5/6 cable touching the live terminals, if this was to ever wear through it could cause damage to IT infrastructure, also not sure how you are achieving electrical separation between mains and network cables after the joint as it looked like you didn't use a shielded network cable after the cable joint. This can give interference into the network cable through induced EMFs and corrupt data. Interesting video though!
@OldLordSpeedy 2 роки тому
I am certificated Computer Specialist for data cables. I never install power cables together with Cat3 (or better) if I can do it other way. Specially direct near 16 mm² power cable with 63 Ampere.
@FirstDan2000 2 роки тому
ELV cables CAN be run next to LV cables providing the insulation on it is to the standard of the higher voltage cable (i.e. 400volts). I think the manufacturer of the multi-cable knows this and has insulated the data cores with a sheath matching that of the conductors. The demonstration shows the installer adding some heat shrink near to the joint terminals to increase the mechanical protection of the data cable above and beyond what is necessary- just for their own overall good standards. I do take your point about interference into the data cable though, but I believe the data cable part of the multi-cable is screened. The multi-cable couldn't have a BASEC type approval if it didn't comply with the standards of both types of seperate cable. Does this sound satisfactory to anyone?
@hartpa 2 роки тому
I haven't done electrics since a city and guilds 2360 pt1 so I'm an idiot. But I thought regs said high voltage and low voltage data should never run together? Has that then changed? Great video by the way, thanks.
@efixx 2 роки тому
If the voltage rating of the cables are greater than the maximum system voltage then it’s okay.
@hartpa 2 роки тому
@@efixx ahh. Thank you.
@abdulseaforth6930 Рік тому
I believe this solution was the best when you have to consider the acute bend. Tempting though it is to run the rubber cable throughout, when all considered- rodents- you run in the SWA cable.
@maxmayer4247 Рік тому
we use H07RN-F for fixed installations and its much easier to deal with than with single core aluminum cable
@2Sorts Рік тому
Alooomimun cable, still using alooomimun? I thought Aluminium was pretty much phased out in the developed world?
@maxmayer4247 Рік тому
@@2Sorts not for 25 mm²
@2Sorts Рік тому
@@maxmayer4247 In the UK, the supply cable that feeds our distribution panels in domestic premises is 25mm copper
@maxmayer4247 Рік тому
@@2Sorts I work in Germany, we use a mix of sometimes copper sometimes aluminum, at these cross sections
@mastergx1 Рік тому
Certainly easier and less messy - only time will tell if it remains as waterproof as a fully potted swa join.
@aryehelectricalltd7247 2 роки тому
Why not the full length with h07 cable
@brianharrington2262 2 роки тому
Just wanted to know why this cat5e can be run or incorporated inside a mains cable regardless of insulation quality we have close proximity.What am I missing tia.
@efixx 2 роки тому
It's connecting an EV charger which needs data - but isn't a data centre in terms of transmission rates. The only data being transmitted is the power consumption, charging status and security info for RFID tags.
@brianharrington2262 2 роки тому
@@efixx Thanks understood similar to BMS installation
@bramcoteelectrical1088 Рік тому
Regulation 521.9. 1 permits the use of flexible cables for fixed wiring if they are of the heavy duty type or the risk of damage is low or protection against mechanical protection is provided.
@memecoinmafia2732 2 роки тому
i think you have introduced a path for water ingress with that heat srink
@hhe5218 2 роки тому
I'm not familiar with UK electrical code, but why in the world would one use an armored cable when you're running it through pipe ducting?
@efixx 2 роки тому
It’s pretty much standard practice in all UK installs.
@hhe5218 2 роки тому
@@efixx what is the reasoning behind that? The only tangible argument for it I can think of is emc. Here in Norway the requirement for armored cables in (low voltage - sub 1KV) is when there is a risk of mechanical "influence" I.e buried in the ground, or at risk of abrasion or impacts.
@gubbernl 2 роки тому
Indeed strange. Doesn't the entertainment industry just use the flex cables when transporting energy? And in plain sight, haha. So flex from the junction box to the charger sounds a smart thing to do. Ps. Why CATx cable? Isn't the logic and EV connector build in, in the same box, or is it to manage the max current per car if more cars are charging?
@HenryLoenwind 2 роки тому
@@gubbernl Yes, the data cable is usually used for the CT clamps.
@lukejay 2 роки тому
As an ex CCTV and networking engineer, I really don't like this. That 'ip65 cat5 join' can and will fail. I've had countless issues with them. You'd be better running the data cable separately in a dedicated duct grade cable, or making the join above ground level.
@jonathantatler 2 роки тому
Sub joints are pretty good IF installed correctly. It is better not to have them underground however and if ducted or otherwise protected rubber cable is cheaper and much easier to work with
@Rishnai 2 роки тому
@@jonathantatler Until it gets old enough to need fixed…
@adventuremax Рік тому
it was IP68 i think you'll find
@_Miner 2 роки тому
Not finished the lewden advent calendar yet?
@nobodynoone2500 2 роки тому
As long as you run conduit, whatever. The existing charger systems are due to change again. Seems a bit of a waste, to spend all that money, and your new car is still outside in the rain and sun. You guys really are good at spending the money of others for things that "sound good".
@nobodynoone2500 2 роки тому
Wow you ran low-voltage cable in the same conduit? How is that even allowed there? Buncha hacks.
@efixx 2 роки тому
It’s allowed if the voltage ratings are the same for each cable > 500VAC
@cmh-re 2 роки тому
here in italy I've never seen anyone selling armored cables. we use "rubber" cables for plugs and all of the things that you can move, and a more resistant plastic for outdoor and underground cables. Also we use conduits everywere in constructions so we use individual cables there. They all are made of fire retardand matherials.
@bradhome10 2 роки тому
Any reason for using SWA as opposed to NYY cable ?
@jonathanireland2913 2 роки тому
NYY doesn't get enough of a mention here in the UK... It is great stuff!
@efixx 2 роки тому
It's tricky to get NYY in larger conductor sizes in the UK (for less than you'd pay for SWA) - Doncaster make a great variant of NYY with XLPE insulation - ukposts.info/have/v-deo/b4CUbZiKqXmKtas.html
@jeremysargent5037 Рік тому
So...difficult to bend...what about the minumum radius requirements? This is dependent on the diameter and not the material.
@k7y 2 роки тому
isn't flexible cable super expensive compared to normal electric cables with thick core. I remember when I was buying car sub wires and 2 AWG copper wire was like £10-15 per meter.
@markcampbell4576 2 роки тому
Question and totally off topic gents and would appreciate you're thoughts. (Commercial kichen) My double draw freezer has come with a 13amp moulded plug. The socket on the wall is a 16amp 3 pin blue socket outlet. Can the 13amp plug on the freezer be changed to a 16amp 3 pin blue plug to suit the socket on the wall???
@efixx 2 роки тому
Probably a question for the manufacturers - if it’s European manufacturers the fuse will be in the oven. uk 🇬🇧 they may have not bothered and rely upon the plug fuse.
@OldLordSpeedy 2 роки тому
Do you could put before the CEE 16 2pol+earth connector a cu with a 13 A fuse. The kind of a CEE connector mean the max. only. So many Italian camping places use 10 A and older Greece camping places only 13 A for every CEE socket. They are two CEE blue 2pol+earth connectors on the market, one with max. 16 A and one with max. 32 A. The second connector is a little bigger.
@marct3928 2 роки тому
Make up a short jumper cable with a 16A plug on one end and a 13A rubber trailing socket on the other. It would avoid having to lop off the moulded 13A plug any concerns over the appliance warranty, and remain fully compliant. Personally, I'd use 1.5mm sq rubber HO7RNF for this since it's in a kitchen, and a quality rubber socket (eg MK PN# FC133BLK).
@awchattha9451 Рік тому
@ 5:35 fiber optic-- heartbreaking 😅😅
@bramcoteelectrical1088 Рік тому
I use rubber and duct grade cat 5e but would use swa if going into a duct maybe...its a 50/50 really. Have to weight up will the ground be domestic and will there be any digging?? Swa is a safe bet thou... have to think about the risks....
@Mike_5 2 роки тому
Doesn't rubber cable break down when petrochemicals such as petrol or diesel come into contact with the sheath?
@timbo19 2 роки тому
No, as I recall, BS7909 which is the guidance for temp electrical systems pertaining to the outdoor events industry, specifies the use of H07 particularly because of it's oil resistance when used around generators etc.
@JoffiPhone 2 роки тому
Indeed it does, the sheath swells and eventually becomes permeable. I work in the pump industry and have seen this previously.
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